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Originally posted by timhorgan
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a 'much more mature and more appropriate' designation than what exactly? -
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Have definitely seen that one being awarded on PDF recruit classes in the pastOriginally posted by Rhodes View Post"Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"Comment
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Having won best soldier myself... *pats self on back* I can safely say its still on the cards each year.
as is finishing top spot on a course by scores and also winning best overall soldier on a course."He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
"No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."Comment
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I won "Best Shot" myself, and I narrowly lost out on "Best Recruit". Other awards included "Best Fitness" and "Best Endeavour".
My section Cpl told me that despite my advantage of experience from the ACF over my fellow recruits, I allowed myself to coast through most of basic training and didn't start demonstrating my potential until the Final Fling Ex when I was nominated as section commander. It was a lesson learned. I thought I was being a grey man, the reality is that I wasn't giving my all until the spotlight was put on me.
RGJ, I think what Tim is trying to get a rise out of you is over the use of the term "Best Soldier" (PDF) over "Best Recruit" (BA), making the assumption that being called a "Best Soldier" is more "mature" than being called a "Best Recruit".
Personally, I think he's wrong, but it's to be expected from someone with no experience in such matters.
"Best Recruit" is awarded to the individual who rose above the other recruits in terms of standards, attitude, skill, etc, over the course of basic training. The award is given at the passing out parade, where a recruit is not considered a soldier until they have "passed out", so therefore it would be premature of Tim to assume that it is better for someone to be considered the "Best Soldier" when in reality they have yet to march off the square, the rite of passage to becoming a soldier. How can you be the "Best Soldier" when you're not a soldier yet? Therefore you must have been assessed, judged and awarded on your abilities as a recruit.
While I don't begrudge the PDF using the term "Best Soldier", I believe that "Best Recruit" is more appropriate in this case, and that "Best Soldier" can be awarded for further courses and competitions in a soldier's career.
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totally agree with you mate - soldiers are a result of many months of arduous training as a recruit.Originally posted by SwiftandSure View PostI won "Best Shot" myself, and I narrowly lost out on "Best Recruit". Other awards included "Best Fitness" and "Best Endeavour".
My section Cpl told me that despite my advantage of experience from the ACF over my fellow recruits, I allowed myself to coast through most of basic training and didn't start demonstrating my potential until the Final Fling Ex when I was nominated as section commander. It was a lesson learned. I thought I was being a grey man, the reality is that I wasn't giving my all until the spotlight was put on me.
RGJ, I think what Tim is trying to get a rise out of you is over the use of the term "Best Soldier" (PDF) over "Best Recruit" (BA), making the assumption that being called a "Best Soldier" is more "mature" than being called a "Best Recruit".
Personally, I think he's wrong, but it's to be expected from someone with no experience in such matters.
"Best Recruit" is awarded to the individual who rose above the other recruits in terms of standards, attitude, skill, etc, over the course of basic training. The award is given at the passing out parade, where a recruit is not considered a soldier until they have "passed out", so therefore it would be premature of Tim to assume that it is better for someone to be considered the "Best Soldier" when in reality they have yet to march off the square, the rite of passage to becoming a soldier. How can you be the "Best Soldier" when you're not a soldier yet? Therefore you must have been assessed, judged and awarded on your abilities as a recruit.
While I don't begrudge the PDF using the term "Best Soldier", I believe that "Best Recruit" is more appropriate in this case, and that "Best Soldier" can be awarded for further courses and competitions in a soldier's career.
if a new rifleman turned up in battalion and told anyone he was the 'Best Soldier' he would find himself consuming a hearty amount of shoe pie.
if a new rifleman turned up in battalion and told anyone he was the 'Best Recruit' he would find himself in a good position for the rest of his career.
you can be the 'Best Recruit' at the end of basic training - but you are a long way off being 'Best Soldier'.
i am fine with the Irish DF awarding 'Best Soldier' as it is just a name meaning pretty much the same thing, but when Horgan tries twist it into something it isn't then it needs putting right.
anyhow, well done to those of you who were awarded 'Best Recruit' or 'Best Soldier' - including Irish Kid especially.Last edited by RoyalGreenJacket; 6 September 2011, 10:54.Comment
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recent E Bde (2011) RDF recruits in the curragh were awarded a best recruit and not best soldier... this is in keeping with the fact that they are not yet fully trained individuals.
best soldier is only awarded to those 2 or 3 star privates in my own unit who have shone out from amongst (the ever dwindling) ranks of privates."He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
"No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."Comment
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Hi RGJ - Nothing to do with you or the BA-I was just putting forward the view to members of IMO here who have served the Irish Colours that I thought that the designation "Best Soldier" was a nice professional touch that indicated a very progressive mindset in our own Army. I know that the young man in Kerry who received it had the statuette displayed proudly in the family sittingroom.
I would have explained further but you seem to have made up your own mind below. Anyway, we must move onOriginally posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
i am fine with the Irish DF awarding 'Best Soldier' as it is just a name meaning pretty much the same thing, but when Horgan tries twist it into something it isn't then it needs putting right.Comment
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A question to IMO Members generally and the MODs:
Is it possible any longer to put even the most straightforward contribution on here without being subjected to personal attack by a small element who are trying to dominate the site and bully everyone else? I put on a simple observation that I thought "Best Soldier" was a very positive designation and this is the response we get. Where is D..cman when we need him most?
RoyalGreenJacket;
i am fine with the Irish DF awarding 'Best Soldier' as it is just a name meaning pretty much the same thing, but when Horgan tries twist it into something it isn't then it needs putting right..Swift&Sure: RGJ, I think what Tim is trying to get a rise out of you is over the use of the term "Best Soldier" (PDF) over "Best Recruit" (BA), making the assumption that being called a "Best Soldier" is more "mature" than being called a "Best Recruit".
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Who is trying to get a rise out of whom?
Best recruit is for the best recruit on recruit training.
Best soldier is for the best soldier on any course other that recruit training (for the reasons given above) or, in some units, it is an annual award for the best soldier in that unit for the year according to the criteria laid down."Fellow-soldiers of the Irish Republican Army, I have just received a communication from Commandant Pearse calling on us to surrender and you will agree with me that this is the hardest task we have been called upon to perform during this eventful week, but we came into this fight for Irish Independence in obedience to the commands of our higher officers and now in obedience to their wishes we must surrender. I know you would, like myself, prefer to be with our comrades who have already fallen in the fight - we, too, should rather die in this glorious struggle than submit to the enemy." Volunteer Captain Patrick Holahan to 58 of his men at North Brunswick Street, the last group of the Four Courts Garrison to surrender, Sunday 30 April 1916.Comment
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thank you Vickers.Originally posted by Vickers View Post
anyhow we now have one of your Privates (ex 27th Batt) serving as a Rifleman (now 2RIFLES) with us.
i'm pretty confident he will do well and be promoted within the next 2 years (you can mark my words here!) despite serving 4 years (i think) with the Irish DF with no promotion, so we can look at 'age profiles' then too.Last edited by RoyalGreenJacket; 6 September 2011, 12:52.Comment
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Whats in a name ? Whatever title is used refers to an individual who receives an award at the end of their recruit training. Different armies. Live with it.Every man thinks meanly of himself for not having been a soldier - Samuel JohnsonComment
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Eons ago, the unit I served with had best recruit, for obviously best recruit , but also had a best soldier which was awarded annually to the member of the unit who had contributed most in the previous year.
NCOS were also considered for the award where officers were not.
It was discontinued aabout 2000.
Pity as it seems agood idea to acknolwedge the contributions of those who put in the effort without having to award them a DSM!Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safeComment
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