Representation

[Jessup]

There have been cases in the last few years of cadets with masters & PhDs.

But they didn't get to go to USAC did they. Please tell me they didn't?

And back my original question. How are pre Cdt Sch graduates working out in Units? There were concerns in the past. The 2Bn were targeted with a batch back in the early noughties and they worked all pretty well but I think there's one lemon there now that is giving the concept a bad name.

[johnny no stars]

Jessup, it wasn't said in any nasty manner, if you get my drift.

[Jessup]

It's was a bit insensitive though, was it not. I wasn't there so don't know the context. One of the best Sgts I ever worked with (or was it I worked for...........you know that kind of Sgt ) got commissioned recently and I know first hand what he had to do to get his degree and he'd be rightly peeved if someone who maybe had things laid on for him with a Masters called it a basic degree.

[johnny no stars]

It's was a bit insensitive though, was it not. I wasn't there so don't know the context. One of the best Sgts I ever worked with (or was it I worked for...........you know that kind of Sgt ) got commissioned recently and I know first hand what he had to do to get his degree and he'd be rightly peeved if someone who maybe had things laid on for him with a Masters called it a basic degree.

Entirely different context I wasn't peeved at all, after all, it IS only a basic degree... (albeit level 8). I feel I have every right to say this, sitting here having spent my entire Sunday doing computer analysis and typing up reports :P

[paul g]

An organisation can only benefit with people having higher degrees. The US army is a perfect example, look at Dr David Petraeus, (PhD Standford), Stanley M Crystal (Msc in international Relations), in fact many of the top american commanders have not only professional quaifiations but also graduate degrees from top civilan institutions, many completed part time.

As for the Sgt who completed his degree part time, from my own experience, the fact that people do degrees part time and balance them with a job, wife ,kids etc, is a major bonus for employers. Given a choice between somebody able to do that and a spotty 21 year old, guess who most employers wuld choose.

I for one think that the present scheme is a bit outdated,it made sense in 1969 when numbers going to university were quite low, but now doesn't. I think that perhaps recruiting grduates, and then sending then off, in their late 20's early 30's for advanced degrees might be more efficent use of tax payers resources. And the fact is that they only get a basic honours degree.


Recruiting cadets with degrees and sending them off whewn they're more mature for graduate study means that commanders are exposed to the world beyond the military, it would provide them with access to decision makers in civilian life and an international perspective, it gives them a wider exposure to life outside the officers mess, unlike UCG, where you're with your cadet class.

[trellheim]

An organisation can only benefit with people having higher degrees

That's not entirely true. It benefits with SOME people having higher degrees.

Should every soldier have a Ph.D ? Now a BQ having an MA in logistics design - yes.

OTOH recent moves in Germany have moved towards the basic degree being 7 years long

I recruit for the Irish IT business among other things, anything beyond the BA BSc is counterproductive usually

[luchi]

Although I am all for education I think too many people are over awed by people with letters after their name.

doing a masters in history or a PhD in renaissance art is all well and good for personal interest# but what good is it for a Coy Comander?
Was it last year that the papers reported that one of the officers going to Chad had recently completed his degree in Geography?
Useful but hardly vital for the service?

[terrier]

Was it last year that the papers reported that one of the officers going to Chad had recently completed his degree in Geography?
Useful but hardly vital for the service?

I think ''Geography '' now covers a multitude of subjects.... including environmental science which is very pertinent to the future deployment of the IDF.

[Truck Driver]

Was it last year that the papers reported that one of the officers going to Chad had recently completed his degree in Geography?

Unless I' m mistaken, it would also be very pertinent to things "cartography" - another
vital aspect of things in the DF

[luchi]

Unless I' m mistaken, it would also be very pertinent to things "cartography" - another
vital aspect of things in the DF

No doubt but how many people with a PhD would the army require.

My point being that if there is a need for someone to be qualified in a certain dicipline then so be it. Having 200 officers with PhDs in cartography might look good but would be quite wastful if there was only posts for 2.

[FoxtrotRK]

Having 200 officers with PhDs in cartography might look good but would be quite wastful if there was only posts for 2.

I don't think anyone is advocating that?

[FoxtrotRK]

I recruit for the Irish IT business among other things, anything beyond the BA BSc is counterproductive usually

Slightly (entirely) off-topic, but seeing as I'm doing my Masters' in this area, can you elabourate a bit? PM if it's better not to derail the thread.

[trellheim]

The extra work to get the MA/MSc [2 years ] is not usually productive in terms of added value as compared to the amount of training you need in line work to be productive.

IE I'm still going to have to train you for 2 years MSc or BSc so why aren't you out earning now ? If the basic degree is an MSc in Comp. App or Bus. Tech. then fair enough. - but you need to have your story straight else why try and enter the business at all ?

[FoxtrotRK]

Taught. I see your point about Research, I think they're more suited for someone looking to enter academia rather than industry.

Trellheim, trust me, I'd much rather be out earning, it was never my intention to do a masters straight after my undergrad, but opportunities are few and far between, at least they were when I graduated, though things seem to be picking up if you're willing to travel.

The course coordinator for my post-grad used the phrase "sheltering from the rain" to describe upskilling through a course in university during a recession.

[paul g]

People are not pointing out that lots of people complete their Bsc, go to work in the IT industry, and then in their late 20s early 30s go off and complete something like an MBA, because it gives them greater options.

I've got a phd, and after completing it, joined the prison service in the UK starting off as a prison officer. No real link, although I was the best educated officer in the organisations history. Now I was on a graduate scheme, but the fact that i had developed lots of skills meant that I was able to advance at a more rapid rate then my counterparts. And I also knew a lot of politicians and political researchers through my time in university.