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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orion View Post
    Not just the RAF the army reserve calls the AA in the event of a vehicle breakdown ...
    If you're broken down on the side of the M6 Southbound...during rush hour...who should you call?

    The 'A' Team????
    'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by spider View Post
    If you're broken down on the side of the M6 Southbound...during rush hour...who should you call?

    The 'A' Team????
    Glad you think its funny .... you are joking of course ???

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orion View Post
    Glad you think its funny .... you are joking of course ???
    I was being tongue in cheek Mate...

    I drive 'White Fleet' vehicles regularly...if they break down a civilian company...possibly the AA (I'm not sure to be honest) will come and recover you.

    'Green Fleet' vehicles...if they are moving in convoys...will do so in packets...usually by Company / Squadron.

    The last packet will always have a recovery vehicle (wrecker)...crewed by a couple of recovery mechanics...

    https://apply.army.mod.uk/roles/roya...overy-mechanic

    Their job is to recover broken-down / damaged vehicles and get them to a place where they can be repaired.

    Great soldiers with a real 'can-do' attitude.

    That model works in both the Regular Army and Army Reserve.

    If a Green Fleet vehicle is not moving as part of a convoy...maybe singularly or in a pair...then they won't have a wrecker with them.

    So if a vehicle from Inverness breaks down on the M6 Southbound somewhere around Coventry...then it makes sense that a contractor will come out and recover them...though I've never personally seen this myself.

    Also, a lot of the day to day heavy lifting of armour is done by contractors; if it wasn't you'd have soldiers continually tied up in traffic jams on the UKs wonderful motorway network.

    They'd never get any military training done.

    Using contractors isn't always a bad thing!
    'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by spider View Post
    I was being tongue in cheek Mate...

    I drive 'White Fleet' vehicles regularly...if they break down a civilian company...possibly the AA (I'm not sure to be honest) will come and recover you.

    'Green Fleet' vehicles...if they are moving in convoys...will do so in packets...usually by Company / Squadron.

    The last packet will always have a recovery vehicle (wrecker)...crewed by a couple of recovery mechanics...

    https://apply.army.mod.uk/roles/roya...overy-mechanic

    Their job is to recover broken-down / damaged vehicles and get them to a place where they can be repaired.

    Great soldiers with a real 'can-do' attitude.

    That model works in both the Regular Army and Army Reserve.

    If a Green Fleet vehicle is not moving as part of a convoy...maybe singularly or in a pair...then they won't have a wrecker with them.

    So if a vehicle from Inverness breaks down on the M6 Southbound somewhere around Coventry...then it makes sense that a contractor will come out and recover them...though I've never personally seen this myself.

    Also, a lot of the day to day heavy lifting of armour is done by contractors; if it wasn't you'd have soldiers continually tied up in traffic jams on the UKs wonderful motorway network.

    They'd never get any military training done.

    Using contractors isn't always a bad thing!
    The DF also now have a white (or be it green/black) now. Afaik it is DF owned and DF driven

    The thing is that soldier who was replaced was as a soldier multitasked.

    As I understand it there is still a military HET capability via sponsored reserves (they are civvies for the day to day driving to the training area but can be mobilised for deployment)

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    The DF also now have a white (or be it green/black) now. Afaik it is DF owned and DF driven

    The thing is that soldier who was replaced was as a soldier multitasked.

    As I understand it there is still a military HET capability via sponsored reserves (they are civvies for the day to day driving to the training area but can be mobilised for deployment)
    There is indeed Dev...its a mixture of military personnel / civvies (mainly ex-military) who are sponsored reserves.

    So in war time they get mobilised.

    I'm not a 'spotter' but apparently the way to distinguish is that if a HET is double-manned the crew are soldiers...single-manned one of those SR dudes.

    They drive these (and armoured variants of) https://www.army-technology.com/projects/oshkosh/

    The only person I've ever spoken to about it was a doorman at a nightclub in Salisbury...he was in the HET Sqn at Bulford...said the civvy SR thing had ruined a great trade...and was getting out...to be a full-time doorman.
    'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

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  7. #56
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    Air Corps helicopter still tackling Wicklow wildfires

    https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/201...3274-wildfire/

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  9. #57
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    Early start for them this year, at least it hasn't been as bad as the one in England.

  10. #58
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    Air Corps deployed to Donegal to fight gorse fire.



  11. #59
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    DF getting a lot of stick for the delay in deploying the helicopters/troops on ground - request was made at 9am.

  12. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by pym View Post
    DF getting a lot of stick for the delay in deploying the helicopters/troops on ground - request was made at 9am.
    Is it the AC/Army, DOD, or Minister that should be getting the stick or a combination?

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  14. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by pym View Post
    DF getting a lot of stick for the delay in deploying the helicopters/troops on ground - request was made at 9am.
    Because of course, on an Easter Monday, the entire DF would have been sitting around their barracks at 07.00 in case anybody needed them to fight fires in Donegal...
    'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
    'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
    Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
    He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
    http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

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  16. #62
    Chief Casey Ryback
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    Maybe Saoradh should have sent their elite foot stomping military surplus wearing troops to help out .
    Don't spit in my Bouillabaisse .

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  18. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flamingo View Post
    Because of course, on an Easter Monday, the entire DF would have been sitting around their barracks at 07.00 in case anybody needed them to fight fires in Donegal...
    And because the chain of comms goes from local TD to Minister

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  20. #64
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    From RTE.

    ....Asked about the response time from the Air Corps to the fire, spokesman Captain Kevin Fitzgerald said the Air Corps does not have the resources for a dedicated firefighting service.

    He said the Air Corps is not the primary firefighting agency for the State, so when it was given the tasking it had to mobilise a crew first.



    Capt Fitzgerald said there is a crew in Baldonnell for the Garda Air Support Unit and in Athlone for the medical service.

    Local TD Pat the Cope Gallagher issued a statement last night questioning why it took, what he said was seven hours, for the Air Corps to mobilise a helicopter to assist in the firefighting effort.

    Capt Fitzgerald said the crew tasking was approved at around 1pm yesterday, but the morning was spent assembling a crew.

    He said such a tasking cannot be launched straight away as a crew has to be assembled and briefed on the situation.
    https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2019/...al-gorse-fire/

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  22. #65
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Department only approved the request around 1pm

  23. #66
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    If Pat wasnt so busy being a shouty man, he could have asked the British Army or PSNI to detail a helicopter to do a bit of crossborder cooperation and deploy a bambi bucket, whilst waiting for the AC to get sorted, or he could have picked up the phone book, looked under "H" for helicopter and rung around, asking if anyone had a turbine helicopter lying idle, with a bambi bucket going spare, for a bit of firefighting. Back in the day, Irish Helis used to do it, with a Huey...

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  25. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    If Pat wasnt so busy being a shouty man, he could have asked the British Army or PSNI to detail a helicopter to do a bit of crossborder cooperation and deploy a bambi bucket, whilst waiting for the AC to get sorted, or he could have picked up the phone book, looked under "H" for helicopter and rung around, asking if anyone had a turbine helicopter lying idle, with a bambi bucket going spare, for a bit of firefighting. Back in the day, Irish Helis used to do it, with a Huey...
    I understamd a civvy heli was in action before the air corps aircraft became available.

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  27. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by na grohmiti View Post
    I understamd a civvy heli was in action before the air corps aircraft became available.
    Coillte have a contracted helicopter for fire fighting.
    Last edited by Rhodes; 27th April 2019 at 00:00.

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  29. #69
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    As it seems another summer of (very) hot, dry periods are about to hit Europe and Ireland again, fire fighting use might be a good reason for the Air Corps to trial some heavier lift, relatively basic transport helicopters?

    Not just for bigger under-slung water buckets, but maybe alternating with carrying fire crews and their equipment inside the helicopters.
    If such helicopters are then chosen and obtained, when these are ‘out-of-season’ for fire fighting, and other civil aid functions, they could of course be used for other more military duties.

    Whatever Coillte may have available to them for rent/ contract for fire fighting, i’m going to guess that they would not be of anything bigger equivalent than the Air Corp’s current light/ medium AW139 helicopters.

    Either way, with more hot summers, and fires likely, more and not less aircraft will likely be needed (helicopters... (or... fixed-wing very specialised planes)) and with well-qualified pilots, who also have less restrictions to access whatever areas for flying.

    In Ireland, there are not a huge amount of forests compared to other countries, and as a result forestry is fairly precious, as either they are cash crops (e.g. conifers, not just Coillte’s), and the more recreational/ tourism/ wildlife ‘broad leaf’ forests are not that common, so also very valuable in their own (many) ways.
    Then there are also potential bog fires? What are Bord Na Mona’s provisions for this, or worse what happens with any fires (?) on remaining non-Bord Na Mona bogs if they are vulnerable?

    Such assets could also be used for co-operation for these kinds of duties in extreme cases, in other European countries (i guess i can’t just state the ‘EU’ any more!), which in the last decade there obviously have been some. A very functional and PR friendly (but ultimately part-time) use overall i would have thought.

  30. #70
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    There is a multitude of well proven reasons the Air Corps should have more helicopters, not just larger ones. The reqirement for MLH that saw us almost get S92s a decade ago have not changed. If anything, there are more reasons for it.
    The problem is keeping aircraft in the air. It appears aircraft availability is becoming an issue, a recent flypast in Clifden only managed to see 2 PC9 and one Casa. 4 PC9 would have been the norm in the past.
    You need to have enough aircraft to allow for 40% availability at least, and enough tecnicians to keep that 40% flying while others are in various states of maintenance. Having enough pilots would also help.
    German 1: Private Schnutz, I have bad news for you.
    German 2: Private? I am a general!
    German 1: That is the bad news.

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  32. #71
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    AW139 is probably adequate for the 1,000 litre Bambi bucket. There is possibly the issue of range but that can (and is) offset by sending a tanker.

    The problem is more aircraft availability (also tied to technician Availability) and pilot availability. 2-3 x AW139 will achieve the aim faster and more efficiently than 1.

    Also important is speed of response, so firstly that means early detection, early response to fire brigade (including calling out of Civil Defence (who’s Auxiliary Fire Service now concentrate on flooding)), early call to DoD, quick decision making & early wheels up

  33. #72
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    Hire in a CL-415 if you want serious water bombing capability; the entire country is full of bodies of water that they can refill on and land on and the country is falling down with airports and airfields that a CL-415 can use. Hire a crew and aircraft for the period from May to September and the amount of fires they quench will justify the cost.

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  35. #73
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    I'm surprised at how numerous the above CL-415 family is for fire-fighting fleets around the world!

    Have a look at the below links to the 'Godzilla' of seaplanes, and all you never wanted to know about large amphibian planes

    http://www.shinmaywa.co.jp/aircraft/...us2_world.html

    http://www.shinmaywa.co.jp/aircraft/.../us2_fire.html

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  37. #74
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    Just to give you a real world example of a hire-in currently operating in Ireland: there's a Learjet at the HSE's beck and call in Dublin Airport, sitting there at Eu 20,000 a week, to airlift patients for urgent out-of-State medical attention. That's tasty money, by any standard, so hiring in a fire bomber wouldnt be beyond the means of the State.

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  39. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    Just to give you a real world example of a hire-in currently operating in Ireland: there's a Learjet at the HSE's beck and call in Dublin Airport, sitting there at Eu 20,000 a week, to airlift patients for urgent out-of-State medical attention. That's tasty money, by any standard, so hiring in a fire bomber wouldnt be beyond the means of the State.
    Your figures are way off.

    The contract is worth €7m over 2 years. Figure is almost €10k per day.

    And remember, this isnt a 24/7 service. This is only available in very limited circumstances. So if there is an organ harvest in Cork/Kerry. The aircraft will sit in Dublin because it is for "off island" ops only.

    How it hasn't got more attention in political circles is beyond me.
    Last edited by Chuck; 27th June 2019 at 22:36.

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