Defence Forces Artillery

[Aidan]

In general, tracks are a pain in the a$$ to maintain, particularly if you're going to run them on the road. And links and pads are one thing, there's an ongoing maintenance load associated with idlers and road wheels too. Running something on wheels is pretty much always a cheaper and more fuel efficient way of doing things.

For heavier vehicles off road (or for extreme offroad conditions), tracks are the only way to go. But they're best avoided if at all possible.

That said, rubber tracks might have changed that slightly - I know they have been used on M113s but I'm not sure if they've ever been accepted into military service. From experience, with the right suspension setup, they give a very smooth ride on and off road and are relatively fuel efficient, but they are far less effective off road than steel tracks (or even tyres in some conditions).

[Goldie fish]

Aren't the BV206 Rubber tracked?

[DeV]

Would this be any more or less than the scenario where you are towing conventional Arty pieces behind trucks, for instance ?

As Aidan says tracked vehicles are more maintenance intensive (and depending on the vehicle can cause more damage to roads).

But the AD Btys have the BV206 already (fitted with Giraffe). Not sure if these are armoured or not but it gives them mobility in spades.

[Aidan]

Aren't the BV206 Rubber tracked?

Yup - that's what I was trying to refer to. But the BV is very light - highly atypical of military tracked vehicles. That said, they might work on a Scorpion too.

Back on topic though - the DF have effectively standardised on the PIII - if there was to be mobile artillery/mortar system purchased to do long range patrolling, it would essentially have to be mounted on one of these (unless complete units could be bought off the shelf more cheaply).

[Come-quickly]

Therein lies the rub. Equipping a PIII with a 120mm or 105mm tube is far more expensive per unit than buying a lightweight system like CAESAR but putting an 8mm tube in the back of one seems like a waste of a very pricey chassis.

[DeV]

Therein lies the rub. Equipping a PIII with a 120mm or 105mm tube is far more expensive per unit than buying a lightweight system like CAESAR but putting an 8mm tube in the back of one seems like a waste of a very pricey chassis.

Whole life cost is where it's at

[GoneToTheCanner]

Hi there
With regard to rubber tracks, the famous M3 halftrack of WW2 and after had rubber tracks, so the idea is not new. Look at the Israeli M3 mortar carrier as an example.

regards
GttC

[Aidan]

The rubber track idea dates to 1913, but there was a new design of track arrive on the market in the late 1980s (the CAT Challenger tractors were the first users), it's a moulded rubber track with a central 'band' of steel cable embedded in it. It makes the track far more robust and long lasting than the older types - people sometimes call them 'band tracks' for obvious reasons.

A bit of googling shows that the Canadians apparently used them on their M113s operationally;

http://web.archive.org/web/200807032.../bandtrack.htm

[sofa]

Aren't the BV206 Rubber tracked?

yes. also the idler /wheels are PTFE or NYLON

[Gunner Who?]

I had a look at one of those BV206 combinations ,the tracks are wide and made of rubber they weigh 175Kg, the armoured version is BV206(S). On Utube and Google there is a good volume of info.

As posted above the AD Bty in the new Arty Regiments are equipped with the BV206 and Giraffe Mk IV.
The AD Bty can also deploy as a mortar Bty.

[Jungle]

A bit of googling shows that the Canadians apparently used them on their M113s operationally;

We still do, on the TLAV (A3) version of the M113:

M113A3 Tracked Light Armoured Vehicle

The tracks are Canadian-made by a company names Soucy Track.

On my last tour in Kandahar, the OMLT team I was part of was mounted on rubber-tracked TLAVs, and I found they offered a much more comfortable ride then metal tracks, while requiring less maintenance.

[Rhodes]

"2 Artillery Regiment recently conducted a 120 Heavy Mortar and a 105 Gun live firing shoot in the Glen of Imaal, wicklow.
The shoot included newly trained gunners who have joined the unit as a result of the recent re-org and integrated Reserve Defence Members from 4 & 5 Bty of the Regiment."

[DeV]

Excellent video but single force concept with no helmets or CEFO/battlevests?

[pym]

Great video - 120mm mortars and a 105 guns seem to be no match for the bloody midges though!

[Fridge Magnet]

Not a single person wearing CBA in that video.

It's a good thing there's never been any accident's that resulted in a loss of life during shoot's before. Oh wait....