Air Corps air ambulance

[Meatbomb]

My initial comment was a civvi airline can do something that our military can't / won't. That's the joke.
Safety is the first consideration for everyone that straps an a/c to their backs, should never be any other way.

Not that it really matters but those trawlers never requested anything from the CG than to monitor their progress, one had no comms and was escorted in by another f/v. Waterford / Shannon and Sligo bases were given a heads up to plan for a possible tasking but were not tasked. As it turned out the furthest vessel was just shy of 200 nm. From EIKY this was outside the range of the S92 because of the headwind and severely reduced ground speed out. Time on scene would have been very short. JBM I get your point and this isn't a points scoring exercise. If a civvy a/c did an island medevac when the CG wouldn't / couldn't I'd be equally scathing, trust me.
As for the decision making process if a 139 was in Galway the other night with the poor conditions quoted by Brian there is obvious differences in what crews are willing to do. Without knowing the specifics of the weather it sounds like conditions would have been below what the CG could accept for such a tasking as a hems flight has far greater weather restrictions than for the same a/c on a SAR tasking.

[DeV]

My initial comment was a civvi airline can do something that our military can't / won't. That's the joke.
Safety is the first consideration for everyone that straps an a/c to their backs, should never be any other way.
.

Have you read the rest of your post!

[Meatbomb]

Which part DeV? It was kinda long.
The weather limits I'm on about are ones that are written in black and white and laid down by the authority. Huge difference between day and night (300ft day v's 1200ft night) if a 139 was in UCHG in the wee hours in low cloud they clearly have different / lower limits.
Would you like me to clarify any other points?
And if Aer Arann can do it in the prevailing conditions then I can't see why IAC fixed or rotary couldn't do it due weather.

[Jack Booted Man]

An interesting quote from the full story in the Examiner " The air corps typically completes more than 100 standard air ambulance transfers a year and a defence forces spokesman said: "The air corps duty officer received a query [on Sunday night] investigating the possibility of an air ambulance mission from a regional location.

"In line with standard procedures, air corps stand-by crews were consulted. However, the severe weather conditions, including turbulence and high crosswinds, made any mission impossible overnight."

The Kerry-Dublin route is one of two public service obligation routes in Ireland, meaning they are partly subsidised. It is understood that those arrangements are up for review shortly."

So ( and I really didn't want to get into this) are we saying the Defence Forces are spoofing and the Examiner swallowed it ? From another part of the story " Air transport of organs is usually carried out by the air corps or the coast guard, but very high crosswinds and turbulence meant those organising the transfer had to explore using the commercial flight route. " .... So did the CG refuse a tasking as well, coz that's my read of the story. ( if we accept it on face value, which I don't)

Maybe , just maybe , the Aer Arann craft was already overnight in Faranfore during the high cross winds , and any AC fixed wing would have had to land in it .... Outside safety limits , so they said no can do .... Where's the problem and more importantly ... Where's the joke ?

[DeV]

Which part DeV? It was kinda long.
The weather limits I'm on about are ones that are written in black and white and laid down by the authority. Huge difference between day and night (300ft day v's 1200ft night) if a 139 was in UCHG in the wee hours in low cloud they clearly have different / lower limits.
Would you like me to clarify any other points?
And if Aer Arann can do it in the prevailing conditions then I can't see why IAC fixed or rotary couldn't do it due weather.

The bit where you say the AC should have completed the mission even though the IRCG may have refused (if they were flying from Casement.

And then the bit where you safety is the most important thing but say the AC is a joke because they refused a mission on safety grounds!

Not sure if min/Max's are in ACFOs etc or not but the final decision is the Captain's.

As I already, Aer Arann were flying Farrinfore to Dublin Airport, not Casement to Farrinfore (I've already illustrated how the weather was different in Casement and Dublin Airport!

[Meatbomb]

When did I say the IAC was a joke?
I said that a civil carrier doing a flight that the military Cant is a joke. I've never heard of a CG transporting an organ, patients for transfer yes but not an organ. There is no request for an organ transfer that I can find out anywhere for this incident.

JBM, We don't know of the a/c was overnighting in EIKY, if it was fair enough it was the quickest way to get the organ to Dublin. But that flight I assume departed Monday morning, the request came in on Sunday night.
Just to point out that the Shannon, Waterford and Dublin S92's were flying on the Sunday and Monday both training and Waterford had 2 SAR calls. Reason I'm mentioning it is that conditions were suitable for training. Only missions that NACC will request CG for are time critical or immediately life threatening calls (as I've already stated) if NACC contacted the GDO on Sunday night and the organ left on a commercial flight on the Monday then it possibly wasn't deemed time critical (which I find strange)

[Charlie252]

For info Regarding the WX situation, Bal has some advantages, for example when Dub is clampers with Fog Bal can often times be open due to the Orographic effect of the Mountains..
However, when it is windy and particularly from a southwesterly direction the turbulence can be SEVERE as a result of the mountains... Makes the WX decision for the crew painful but in reality the only option when its gusting 51kts.

[Pure Hover]

When did I say the IAC was a joke?
I said that a civil carrier doing a flight that the military Cant is a joke. I've never heard of a CG transporting an organ, patients for transfer yes but not an organ. There is no request for an organ transfer that I can find out anywhere for this incident.

JBM, We don't know of the a/c was overnighting in EIKY, if it was fair enough it was the quickest way to get the organ to Dublin. But that flight I assume departed Monday morning, the request came in on Sunday night.
Just to point out that the Shannon, Waterford and Dublin S92's were flying on the Sunday and Monday both training and Waterford had 2 SAR calls. Reason I'm mentioning it is that conditions were suitable for training. Only missions that NACC will request CG for are time critical or immediately life threatening calls (as I've already stated) if NACC contacted the GDO on Sunday night and the organ left on a commercial flight on the Monday then it possibly wasn't deemed time critical (which I find strange)

Why would you consider a civil carrier doing a flight the military cant to be a joke? What a ridiculous statement. A patient being transported to the UK by commercial means because the military cant do it - is that a joke too? Are civilian carriers somehow less worthy or capable or whatever? Would it not be more appropriate to retract something like that rather than continue bizarrely to try and justify it?

[Saab]

My mate's niece was transfered from Dublin to Great Ormond St last week for a critical surgery.

Great job done by the AC and the ambulance crews that transfered them to Bal and from the airport in London.

According to my mate, who just came home yesterday, it was a very slick operation indeed.

[hptmurphy]

if NACC contacted the GDO on Sunday night and the organ left on a commercial flight on the Monday then it possibly wasn't deemed time critical (which I find strange

the NACC would be aware that organs are going to become available in advance of of the event in a lot of cases.

Organ harvest can only be carried out with families consent. Should some one be on a ventilator, switching the ventilator off may not be the actual end of life.

Organ harvests also take specialist teams to be on site , who only seem to work at night carrying out harvests for a very specific reason which I can't remember off hand.

Its not as haphazard.. as it may appear and I could fully understand why the team knew they could hold the organ until the flight was due to depart Farranfore the next day.

When I worked in Waterford we used to get donated corneas in for WRH on scheduled flights, just the way it could be planned.

Pardon the pun, but its a storm in a tea cup.

[spider]

My mate's niece was transfered from Dublin to Great Ormond St last week for a critical surgery.

Great job done by the AC and the ambulance crews that transfered them to Bal and from the airport in London.

According to my mate, who just came home yesterday, it was a very slick operation indeed.

And isn't that what really matters...peoples lives get saved...by whatever agencies it takes.

Hope she is doing better Saab.

[Tadpole]

So lads, and ladies; How are ye all fixed for the 28th??

[DeV]

????

[Brian McGrath]

Medevac 112 arrived into UCHG yesterday evening, with Rescue 118 holding over the City, 112 then lifted and landed in the football pitch near the pad and 118 came in, an hour later Rescue 115 came in, few pictures from last night. Fantastic life saving service, well done to all involved

[Rhodes]

Defence Forces rush critical patient to UK hospital

The flight is the 22nd inter-hospital air ambulance mission carried out by the Defence Forces this year


An Irish Defence Forces plane on standby

The Defence Forces rushed a critical patient to hospital in the UK by air ambulance last night.

An Air Corps Duty Officer received a 'Priority 1' request to transfer a young patient to a London facility from the National Aeromedical Coordination Centre at 4.30pm on Saturday.

The fixed wing aircraft stand-by crew were contacted, a mission was organised and a CASA Maritime Patrol aircraft was ready to leave for London at 5.55pm.



The plane , call sign 'Irish 252', arrived in Heathrow just after 9pm and the patient made the rest of the journey safely by road.

The flight is the 22nd inter-hospital air ambulance mission carried out by the Defence Forces this year.

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/defence-forces-rush-critical-patient-3301386