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  1. #1
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    Chief of Staff takes wife to Finland on official visit

    The Chief of Staff of the Irish Defence Forces, Lieutenant General Sean McCann and his spouse will arrive in Finland today for an official from 27 to 29 August 2012. The Commander of the Finnish Defence Forces, General Ari Puheloinen will host the visit together with his spouse.

    The programme for Lt Gen McCann's visit will include e.g. an inspection of the guard of honour and discussions at the Defence Command, as well as a visit to the Pori Brigade and the Balex Delta oil pollution response exercise.

    From Defence Professionals
    http://www.defpro.com/news/details/3...808db489ec0c1a

    I would like to know who is paying her way. It would be quite shocking and sicking if the Defence Forces was to foot the bill especially after a young soldier had to pay for his own repatriation from Lebanon a few weeks ago with appendicitis.
    Last edited by almaza; 27th August 2012 at 15:50.

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    Quote Originally Posted by almaza View Post
    ...especially after a young soldier had to pay for his own repatriation from Lebanon a few weeks ago with appendicitis.
    That can't possibly be true?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoxtrotRK View Post
    That can't possibly be true?
    It is. It happened less than two weeks ago.

  4. #4
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    He had a sports hernia. Coincidently, also had his leave due at the same time and therefore had already purchased tickets but my understanding is he will be fully reimbursed due to medical repatriation.

    Back on topic - maybe the Finnish are footing the bill???
    MINGI BREAD


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  6. #5
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    Do you have a source for that? It sounds like theres either a little more or a little less to this story.
    Last edited by Schmigs; 27th August 2012 at 17:58.

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  8. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmigs View Post
    Do you have a source for that? It sounds like theres either a little more or a little less to this story.
    Well i'd like to think i'm the source but without giving names I can tell yea he a northern lad in B coy 106 BN, home unit 5BN. He was well looked after and had to be detailed to go flat coz as soon as he brought his problem to the attention of his superiors.
    I dunno where other people get their info from but seems like people always wanna take a stab at the PDF first chance they get. They're not great in many ways but nobody wanted to repat him and he gets his medal anyway and probably his UN leave too
    Obviously its bad news he had to go home but thats coz he needed surgery.
    MINGI BREAD


  9. #7
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    Thanks userfriendly2, your post wasnt there when i posted. Im not sure what happened there.

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    If someone is trying to stir shit about senior people bringing wives on trips abroad, then it's a bit too late. It's been going on for years and quite simply, it's cheap enough to transport two as one. Worse crimes against the public purse have been committed by all manner of ranks in the DF.

    regards
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  12. #9
    Provost colonel decker's Avatar
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    He is all right leave him alone.
    OK Smith it’s Colonel Decker. I hate it when a plan comes together. You’re surrounded. I want you and Peck and Baracus, to throw out your weapons, all the ration packs you stole and come out with your hands up. You have fifteen seconds.

  13. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    If someone is trying to stir shit about senior people bringing wives on trips abroad, then it's a bit too late. It's been going on for years and quite simply, it's cheap enough to transport two as one. Worse crimes against the public purse have been committed by all manner of ranks in the DF.

    regards
    GttC
    and by others in other public service jobs. I'd have no problem with Lt.Gen McCann bringing the Mrs so long as it's only now and again.

  14. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by almaza View Post
    ...I would like to know who is paying her way. It would be quite shocking and sicking if the Defence Forces was to foot the bill....
    whats the cost of the Mrs going as well?

    if they went in a DF aircraft then the additional cost was €0, if they went by commercial carrier then its usual practice is that the Mrs pays her own way, unless she is undertaking any diplomatic (in the widest sense) tasks in which case the state pays.

    hotel room? paid for already, the Gen will be in a decent double room - no extra cost if the Mrs shares his bed.

    Food? any official functions or visits will be at the cost of the hosts, breakfast would be thrown in for free at the hotel, and they might go out as a couple for dinner one night.

    thats it - and given that this is a DF that is continuing to spend €150,000pa on the dog food school while not being able to afford to hire a minibus and some ferry tickets to send a team to Cambrian Partrol in Wales, i'd suggest they've got bigger fish to fry than whether the wife of a senior officer got a free Big Mac and fries...

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  16. #12
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    Nobody complaining about Presidents who travel with their spouses? Come on guys. This is SOP.

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    Bull, its never alright to bring the spouse on foreign trips - that is why the system in this country is screwed, because we turn a blind eye to things like the COS bringing his wife on a mingy trip. In his defence, he is simply doing what many politicians and senior civil servants do and milking the system, it doesn't mean its right, If the FInns are paying for it then fair enough,but if we are paying for it then it should not be tolerated. Our leaders are supposed to lead by example and seeing as our elected officials seem to have a fairly flexible attitude to leading by example, then our leaders in the DF should do it. Speaking of crimes against the public purse I seem to remember a few years back a certain FF Minister visiting the troops in KFOR and himself and his cronies refused to stay in Camp Clarke, insisting on being put up in a hotel in downtown Pristina instead. This was shortly after the Finnish MOD, COS and a rake of other civil servants on an evaluation trip stayed in the transit accommodation in Camp Ville, there they lived with the troops, queued for their grub with the troops and baring the obvious ceremonial crap received no special attention at all from the Finn Contingent. Didn't happen with the Irish, our lot were too busy playing the Raj card and expecting to be treated like bloody royalty. So when people make the point that it is as cheap to fly two as it is to fly one person on a minty trip, I think they are missing the point - our leaders should lead by example and if that means not taking the OC Home Brigade on a mingy trip to the land of pea soup and pancakes then suck it up, leave her at home, head on over, do the job your paid to do and then get your arse home!

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    Serf hedgehog's Avatar
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    What if Mrs COS is a right bowler, and we know that Finish women especially the military birds are normally quite cute and looser than a bird pretending she s a nurse in CFJ.

    Would it be safe to assume that Almazza is the Chief himself and is trying to stir up controversory so he can say to Mrs COS, hard luck me old Rhino you have to stay at home and hunt truffles while I head off and chase some Heidis and Helgas.
    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere***
    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.

  20. #15
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    It is. It happened less than two weeks ago
    Wouldn't be that strange, Guy I know had to shell out to get a flight home from Liberia after his partner lost a baby...took him two years and shit load of badgering to get the money back.
    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

  21. #16
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    Doubtless Mary Lou will raise a Daíl Question about it.

  22. #17
    .303 MMG Vickers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmigs View Post
    Thanks userfriendly2, your post wasnt there when i posted. Im not sure what happened there.
    As a new poster userfriendly2's posts are moderated and have to be approved by a Mod/Admin. In this case the post was not approved until after your post was posted (as happened again later!)

  23. #18
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    Dexter, it's regarded as par for the course for senior types to bring their wives because in effect, it's a diplomatic visit between two friendly countries that have served together. I'll bet you that the spouses of the senior Finnish military and politicos will be there, because it's regarded as part of the job description, being the wife of a senior soldier. If it greases the wheels a little further, on an already good level of cooperation, then it can only have positive implications for further work with the Finns, at military/political/UN level.
    You could literally spends hours telling stories about the unfairness of the DF but equally, you could spend hours telling stories about the cushy bits and the craic and the inhouse stuff that civvies won't ever share. It works both ways.

    regards
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  24. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by hptmurphy View Post
    Wouldn't be that strange, Guy I know had to shell out to get a flight home from Liberia after his partner lost a baby...took him two years and shit load of badgering to get the money back.
    As bad as it sounds the army were under no obligation whatsoever to reimburse that lad. I'm surprised he actually got the money back. A senior NCO with the 106 had a similar situation involving his partner back at home and had to apply for S/Leave and as a gesture of good will there was a whip-around done and all the lads out of his coy donated 10 dollars. That was to cover the flights home coz the army weren't gonna do it.
    MINGI BREAD


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  26. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vickers View Post
    As a new poster userfriendly2's posts are moderated and have to be approved by a Mod/Admin. In this case the post was not approved until after your post was posted (as happened again later!)
    Makes sense, cheers Vickers.

  27. #21
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    [QUOTE=GoneToTheCanner;378456]Dexter, it's regarded as par for the course for senior types to bring their wives because in effect, it's a diplomatic visit between two friendly countries that have served together. I'll bet you that the spouses of the senior Finnish military and politicos will be there, because it's regarded as part of the job description, being the wife of a senior soldier. If it greases the wheels a little further, on an already good level of cooperation, then it can only have positive implications for further work with the Finns, at military/political/UN level.
    You could literally spends hours telling stories about the unfairness of the DF but equally, you could spend hours telling stories about the cushy bits and the craic and the inhouse stuff that civvies won't ever share. It works both ways.


    Absolutely agree with you - it is par for the course for the Grupenfuhers to bring the old ball and chain, and as many can testify sitting around surrounded by Female Finnish soldiers is not exactly breaking rocks, my point however is that everyone has to swing up the arms with regard to all the reorg/cutbacks/recession talk and it is disappointing to see that the COS is simply carrying on what went on before. Without shite stirring I ask myself would Big Dermot have done the same thing? my experience of both COS is that one was a leader and one was a COS, I'll leave you figure out which is which. Lead by example is all that I am saying, but as Hedge has suggested I wouldn't be surprised if the COS is lurking on the site stirring it up so he can't bring the ball and chain to the land of the Winter War!

  28. #22
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    Quite how they decide that making aircraft available to repatriate civvies from hotspots is do-able yet doing the same for a soldier who's suffered a personal tragedy is not, is beyond me. Those soldiers must not have been photogenic enough.

    regards
    GttC

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  30. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dexter View Post
    Bull, its never alright to bring the spouse on foreign trips - that is why the system in this country is screwed, because we turn a blind eye to things like the COS bringing his wife on a mingy trip. In his defence, he is simply doing what many politicians and senior civil servants do and milking the system, it doesn't mean its right, If the FInns are paying for it then fair enough,but if we are paying for it then it should not be tolerated. Our leaders are supposed to lead by example and seeing as our elected officials seem to have a fairly flexible attitude to leading by example, then our leaders in the DF should do it. Speaking of crimes against the public purse I seem to remember a few years back a certain FF Minister visiting the troops in KFOR and himself and his cronies refused to stay in Camp Clarke, insisting on being put up in a hotel in downtown Pristina instead. This was shortly after the Finnish MOD, COS and a rake of other civil servants on an evaluation trip stayed in the transit accommodation in Camp Ville, there they lived with the troops, queued for their grub with the troops and baring the obvious ceremonial crap received no special attention at all from the Finn Contingent. Didn't happen with the Irish, our lot were too busy playing the Raj card and expecting to be treated like bloody royalty. So when people make the point that it is as cheap to fly two as it is to fly one person on a minty trip, I think they are missing the point - our leaders should lead by example and if that means not taking the OC Home Brigade on a mingy trip to the land of pea soup and pancakes then suck it up, leave her at home, head on over, do the job your paid to do and then get your arse home!
    Well said Dexter, anything being paid from the public purse only covers the public representative in question, spouse/partner should pay from own pocket
    Even in my case, where I would be entitled to a return flight home very so often (depending on location), while on assignment abroad, if I bring out Mrs TD,
    and the company pay for the flight, I forfeit my own return flight home, in this instance. Fair is fair...

    Quote Originally Posted by hedgehog View Post
    What if Mrs COS is a right bowler, and we know that Finish women especially the military birds are normally quite cute and looser than a bird pretending she s a nurse in CFJ.

    Would it be safe to assume that Almazza is the Chief himself and is trying to stir up controversory so he can say to Mrs COS, hard luck me old Rhino you have to stay at home and hunt truffles while I head off and chase some Heidis and Helgas.
    Hedgie, you're a bad, bad man....
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  32. #24
    Commander in Chief hptmurphy's Avatar
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    As bad as it sounds the army were under no obligation whatsoever to reimburse that lad. I'm surprised he actually got the money back
    His father in Law, an ex driver of Officers Commanding a certain unit, accosted one of his former 'charges' and 'talked' him into having the refund made,

    The refund was made within a few days in the form of a cheque !...and not through payroll.

    I only know because the father in law is a neighbour of mine and had been chasing the case for some time!
    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

  33. #25
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    So TD if there is an invatation to an official state function sent for Mr X and Partner.
    Since "and partner" is not as state employee she doesn't go unless she pays for herself?

    Now seriously do you think the MD of the company you work for doesn't charge the company when he brings the missus on work trips?

    Its just the usuall, the higher up you gothe more perks you get.
    You are obviously not high enough up the ladder to have your missus considered important enough to be transported at the companies expence!!!

    And as for Hedggie's comment.
    Having the missus along would be also protecting the DF asset.
    Just think of the cost of all the training etc that would have been invested in the man. It would all be lost if he ran off with some hot tottie!!!!!

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