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Thread: Mali.

  1. #101
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    some vid of ours and yours in Mali:







    nice to see Sgt English listened and sorted her head-dress out.
    RGJ

    ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

    The Rifles

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  3. #102
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    what's wrong RJ? is this too British for you or are you unhappy to see an ONH soldier working with British troops?

    post the Irish DoD's version then if this MoD one isn't good enough for you.

    anyhow i think it's great to see them both working together like this, especially overseas without that dreaded blue beret.
    RGJ

    ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

    The Rifles

  4. #103
    Non Temetis Messor The real Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
    anyhow i think it's great to see them both working together like this, especially overseas without that dreaded blue beret.
    You try to display this sentiment but making pointless comments about what headdress someone is or is not wearing belies what you really think.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
    what's wrong RJ? is this too British for you or are you unhappy to see an ONH soldier working with British troops?

    post the Irish DoD's version then if this MoD one isn't good enough for you.
    See post #93.
    Everyone who's ever loved you was wrong.

  5. #104
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    I'd be inclined to agree about the head dress part to be fair, RGJ. Won't affect performance one bit, ask this fella:

    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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  7. #105
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    Well, I'm sure D is over there not for how she wears a boonie hat but her instructional experience and professionalism.. I'll mention that to her RGJ when she returns home.. lol

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  9. #106
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    RGJ. your comments are very petty and I'm beginning to think you are more a 40 ish Billy no mates behind a computer in your bedroom of your mothers council flat in Camden or somewhere.

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  11. #107
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    There was me forgetting this is our first non-blue hatted mission............. after:

    EUTM Somalia
    ISAF
    EUFOR Bosnia
    SFOR
    IFOR
    KFOR
    INTERFET
    OSCE
    ECMM
    Op Artemis
    EUFOR Chad/CAR
    EUNAVFOR

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  13. #108
    Serf hedgehog's Avatar
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    Who gives a continental fcuk how her hat was for that 1/1000th of a second while the picture was taken. However those who know her, give a fcuk that she is a great Soldier, even better person and excellent and experienced at her job as an instructor, she is one of those I am proud to know.
    Anyway, I was never in Belize so I wouldn't have the bad manners to criticise how the lads in Belize wear their hats.

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  15. #109
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    i'm not on about how she wears her hat, but wearing the right hat.

    the pics of Harry are of him wearing a hat that matches the tone of his uniform and is pictured during down time and not in training.

    i may be mistaken but isn't this Sgt English in this pic?



    that is what i was referring to.

    they had to send 8 people out there - i was just hoping they might have gone with the basics like full correct uniform.

    and of course i know of the many missions the ONH have done without the UN, and sofa i am sorry to disappoint you but i've been a serving soldier since 1988 - in both the ONH and the British Army, and still continue to serve whilst living in a nice house in Aldershot not Camden, and i have more military service and experience than most on here.
    Last edited by RoyalGreenJacket; 24th May 2013 at 09:21.
    RGJ

    ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

    The Rifles

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  17. #110
    Tim Horgan Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Most. But not all. And you should not forget that.


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  18. #111
    Tim Horgan Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
    what's wrong RJ? is this too British for you or are you unhappy to see an ONH soldier working with British troops?

    post the Irish DoD's version then if this MoD one isn't good enough for you.

    anyhow i think it's great to see them both working together like this, especially overseas without that dreaded blue beret.
    Its already been posted on the thread. Twice.


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  19. #112
    Commander in Chief apod's Avatar
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    nice to see Sgt English listened and sorted her head-dress out.
    Listened to whom exactly??The RIR lads??
    i'm not on about how she wears her hat, but wearing the right hat.
    In both the photos of Sgt.English she is wearing the correct hat.
    they had to send 8 people out there - i was just hoping they might have gone with the basics like full correct uniform.
    They did go with full correct uniform.Including some gucci items the rest of us are yet to be issued.Like the UBACS. 5.11 ballcaps and other items.
    and i have more military service and experience than most on here.
    Careful now mate.There are a few of us here who could challenge that statement.Yours is not the only opinion here and the BA way is not the only way of doing things.
    For instance despite your opinion Sgt.English's head dress was worn exactly according to DF SOP for troops overseas in warm climates.Ball caps are worn IN camp along with shirt if on duty or in training.Driflo and ballcaps are worn for routine duties.Outside camp Boonie hats are worn or helmets depending on the threat and a DPM outer,which in this mission is the UBACS.Berets are worn for parades or inspections.
    The only exception to this is the lebanon where we wear ballcaps all the time as the boonie hat does not have a UN badge on it.It's an FP measure.
    Thats all.Carry on.
    Infantry Corps - An Lámh Comhrac


    "Let us be clear about three facts:First of all.All battles and all wars are won in the end by the Infantryman.Secondly the Infantryman bears the brunt of the fighting,his casualties are heavier and he suffers greater extremes of fatigue and discomfort than the other arms.Thirdly,the art of the Infantryman is less stereotyped and harder to acquire than that of any other arm".
    -- Field Marshall Earl Wavell.1948

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  21. #113
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    if i were working under the Malian sun, i'd be wearing the lightest coloured hat i could lay my hands on - and knowing the OC of the Artillery Training Team, i'd be amazed if any two of its members are wearing the same kit: the man is so scruffy tramps edge away from him on park benches.

    i remain concerned that ONH has not fielded an arid/desert DPM uniform for its soldiers, but only for their comfort and protection - wearing a dark green suit in saharan Africa doesn't sound like much fun to me...

    i would image that Sgt. English is making a contribution out of all proportion to her role - like other female soldiers working in 'less desirable' areas of the world, she is doubtless providing a role model to local women, and showing the local men that women are as capable, as professional, and as well educated as any of her male colleagues, and as such is probbly helping to breakdown some of the barriers to female emancipation in that part of the world.

    bloody good luck to her, and all her colleagues - and no, i couldn't give a fcuk what hats they are wearing either...

  22. #114
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    RGJ: I could put up more pics of US and British forces in Afghan conducting ops wearing baseball caps and wearing green jackets with ACU trousers and boots that don't match but it's not a fashion show.

    I just wish the DF could get some good photos back...damn that poor internet connection
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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  24. #115
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    I see we're moving towards the "velcro biceps" too. I wonder will the shirts go the same way...
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

  25. #116
    Commander in Chief RoyalGreenJacket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buck View Post
    RGJ: I could put up more pics of US and British forces in Afghan conducting ops wearing baseball caps and wearing green jackets with ACU trousers and boots that don't match but it's not a fashion show.

    I just wish the DF could get some good photos back...damn that poor internet connection
    we digress however -

    there are hundreds of instances of soldiers wearing the wrong gear, but that is mostly due to the masses literally not being fully issued everything, we had upto 10,000 troops out there in Afghan (and another 7,000 concurrently on ops in Iraq for most of it) to kit out - you had 8 in this instance - if you are going to issue baseball caps - surely you can get them to match the uniform?

    i and most of my mates wore an 'unconventional' base-ball caps in Iraq and Afghan - but never in an official capacity.

    you will still see plenty of DPM kit being used with MTP as we transition, and you will still see many troops wearing non-issue baseball caps during downtime but not in an official capacity.

    but desert colour baseball caps (and boots) worn with temperate camo combats as part of official uniform - not just exercising troops?

    strangely enough i still have 3 x issued uniforms - Desert, DPM and MTP - and i have 3 issued baseball caps - Desert, DPM and MTP.

    i thought her combats might be of a lighter material for operating in Africa instead of Ireland but i think it was highlighted elsewhere that this is not the case.

    anyhow, velcro biceps are essentials these days when wearing CBA.
    RGJ

    ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

    The Rifles

  26. #117
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    Wow, I'm an absolute gear whore and I wouldn't be this interested in the Lady's headdress.

    Whatever is comfortable and keeps the sun out of the eyes, job done, end of; surely?

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  28. #118
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    RGJ, the point isn't about what she's wearing for feck sake, it's about how she can do the job. She wasn't dressed to your exacting standards. Big deal. Can she do the job just as well as if all her clothes were colour coded? Absolutely.

    I think we should have some kind of desert/arid uniform but we don't so we work with what we have.
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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  30. #119
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    Yeah

    I mean come on, its not like we send troops overseas to work in dusty sandy african conditions all the time now is it....

    oh, wait a sec...
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

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  32. #120
    Lt Colonel Buck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by morpheus View Post
    Yeah

    I mean come on, its not like we send troops overseas to work in dusty sandy african conditions all the time now is it....

    oh, wait a sec...
    We all know that at the end of the day it comes down to €. It's bullshit and nobody on here agrees with it but that's how it is.
    I knew a simple soldier boy.....
    Who grinned at life in empty joy,
    Slept soundly through the lonesome dark,
    And whistled early with the lark.

    In winter trenches, cowed and glum,
    With crumps and lice and lack of rum,
    He put a bullet through his brain.
    And no one spoke of him again.

    You smug-faced crowds with kindling eye
    Who cheer when soldier lads march by,
    Sneak home and pray you'll never know
    The hell where youth and laughter go.

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  34. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
    nice to see Sgt English listened and sorted her head-dress out.
    Listened to who exactly? You? She's over there doing a job, so I very much doubt she's on here reading posts and I certainly very much doubt, she wore different head dress because you reckon she should have.

    As Apod said, it's ball cap's in camp and bush hat once you're outside the fence. Simple.

    If you have an issue with the fact the DF doesn't issue desert DPM to it's troops, welcome to the gang, most people have an issue with it. If you have a problem with the fact that desert boots and a ball cap means she's not colour coded, give Gok Wan a ring and I'm sure he'll show you some sympathy.

    "Nice to see Sgt English listened and sorted her head-dress out".... Jesus ****ing Christ.

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  36. #122
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    The very same pic put up of the Irish soldier wearing a ball cap and desert boots, has a French soldier in it wearing Desert DPM, black boots and a green battlevest.

    Nothing to be said about that of course. I'm sure they somehow got it right, it's just DF who warranted criticism for it.

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  38. #123
    Space Lord of Terra morpheus's Avatar
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    from the minister answering questions in the dail thread - today

    Topical Issue Debate

    Defence Forces Equipment


    The particular question I have surrounds the issuing of inappropriate footwear to members of the Defence Forces. As I said at the outset, it might seem like an insignificant issue but for those people who are labouring for us in the deserts of the Lebanon, it is a vitally important issue. Desert boots are normal kit for such tours of duty but I understand members of the Defence Forces have been supplied with steel capped boots, both supplied by the same manufacturer. One set of footwear is appropriate while the other is most inappropriate.

    Minister of State at the Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation (Deputy John Perry): I thank Deputy Ó Fearghaíl for raising this matter. The Minister, Deputy Alan Shatter, asked me to apologise for his unavailability.

    The Department of the Defence has not received any requests from the Defence Forces for the provision of additional clothing. In any event, the procurement of such clothing is a function delegated to the Defence Forces. I am advised there is no issue in regard to the provision of standard issue boots. Prior to departure to the mission area, all personnel would have undergone a kit inspection and any clothing item requiring replacement would have been replaced accordingly.

    Ireland has a long association with UNIFIL since its establishment in 1978 and the 108th infantry battalion of 357 members of the Irish Defence Forces was recently deployed to Lebanon. Participation by members of the Irish Defence Forces in UNIFIL is a continuation of our honourable tradition of supporting the United Nations in the cause of peace and security, a tradition spanning over half a century.

    I will outline the background to the acquisition of clothing and equipment for the Defence Forces. The Department of Defence maintains an open door policy with its acquisition of such clothing and equipment. The principles of transparency, non-discrimination and equality of treatment are applied to the widest possible extent to companies interested in supplying such equipment to the Defence Forces.

    Tender competitions are held by the contracts branch in the Department and the Defence Forces for the acquisition of a wide range of clothing, kit and defensive equipment covering standard ammunition, weapons, armoured personnel carriers, light tactical armoured vehicles and a wide range of clothing and equipment for the individual soldiers to ensure that they are suitably equipped to carry out their roles at home and overseas. The principal aims of such tender competitions are to achieve value for money for such equipment and to ensure a fair tendering process for all companies.

    A particular focus is maintained in ensuring that modern and effective equipment is available for overseas peace support operations.

    The personal equipment, including clothing, which the individual soldiers have at their disposal in Lebanon and on other overseas missions is second to none. It compares favourably with the equipment used by other countries. The Defence Forces authorities have assured the Minister that appropriate force protection assets and capabilities have been deployed to operate in the current and future environment in Lebanon.

    The Defence Forces issue a comprehensive set of clothing to each member of the Defence Forces. This clothing is designed to cope with a wide range of weather conditions at home and overseas. Additional supplementary clothing and footwear may be issued where extreme conditions are to be encountered. I am advised that the Defence Forces are satisfied that the current clothing arrangements are sufficient for the requirements of the Defence Forces. The Minister has been advised that the Defence Forces carry a range of clothing sizes to cater for all sizes. If required, provision is made for an individually sized set of uniforms to be manufactured by the supplier. In recent years, significant work has been carried out on the acquisition of an integrated protection and load carrying system for individual soldiers. This top-of-the-range system includes body armour, helmets, backpacks, rucksacks and battle vests. The battle vests are used for the carriage of essential items such as ammunition, personal radios and water.

    I am advised that military training techniques are up to date in all respects. Defence Forces training plans are specifically structured to provide the capabilities needed to execute the roles assigned to them by the Government. The challenges of preparing military units for participation in international peace support operations constitute the major dimension of the collective training of the Defence Forces. The primary focus of this training is the attainment of a capability for military interoperability in order to conduct peace support operations to international standards. Training standards in the Defence Forces are constantly benchmarked against best international practice. Defence Forces personnel have full access to the best international training standards available. On behalf of the Minister, Deputy Shatter, and myself, I conclude by wishing each member of the 108th Infantry Battalion UNIFIL a safe and successful mission.

    Deputy Seán Ó Fearghaíl: I agree with the vast bulk of what the Minister of State has said. Of course our personnel are well trained. Of course they are suitable to undertake the tasks they will face in Lebanon. Of course the equipment supplied to them is more than adequate for the challenges they will meet. However, the Minister of State did not really respond to the specific issue I raised. He reiterated the point made by the Army Press Office during the week when it completely denied that there is any difficulty with the use of steel-capped boots by the soldiers who have travelled to Lebanon. According to the information I have received, the military authorities erroneously ordered 600 pairs of steel-capped boots instead of desert boots. This has since been denied by the military press office. I have been informed that the normal desert boots were issued to 238 personnel, but that sufficient numbers of such boots were not in stock to meet the needs of all 320 personnel travelling to Lebanon. I have been told that the desert boots have now been withdrawn from those to whom they had been issued and that steel-capped boots have been issued to all personnel. That has given rise to practical difficulties for the soldiers who are representing this State in Lebanon. Unfortunately, it is leading to a certain level of derision for them as they operate alongside people of other nationalities. While I hope the information I have been given is entirely wrong, I doubt that it is. I ask the Minister of State to investigate the matter.

    Deputy John Perry: I can raise that issue directly with the Minister. I said clearly in my initial reply that "additional supplementary clothing and footwear may be issued where extreme conditions are to be encountered". The Deputy said clearly that there is an issue with the supply of footwear. There is no issue with the standard of the boots that have been provided. If the wrong set of boots was issued - steel-capped boots instead of desert boots - I imagine they could be exchanged. I have no doubt that could be done in the same way it is done by any business or operation that receives the wrong delivery. I do not think it is a case of lack of provision by the State in any sense. The best equipment has been made available. If there was a wrong delivery - steel-capped boots rather than desert boots - I expect they can be changed. I imagine that could have been the case. That is my own observation. The Minister has said there is no issue in this regard at the moment. I would be amazed if the Defence Forces were to state in a press release that there is no issue when there is an issue.

    Deputy Seán Ó Fearghaíl: So would I.

    Deputy John Perry: I will raise the Deputy's concerns with the Minister.
    So... where 600 pairs of the wrong type ordered - or delivered?
    typical army solution- issue half the lads with the right boots, run out of the right boots, take back the right boots from half the lads - issue everyone the wrong boots. so now they can all be wrong, in a smart, uniform and soldier like manner....
    Also love the way our gear our one uniform is apparently magoically capable of adapting to all conditions and that our gear is "second to none" ... so who are we comparing with?
    "He is an enemy officer taken in battle and entitled to fair treatment."
    "No, sir. He's a sergeant, and they don't deserve no respect at all, sir. I should know. They're cunning and artful, if they're any good. I wouldn't mind if he was an officer, sir. But sergeants are clever."

  39. #124
    King Monkey FMolloy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fridge Magnet View Post
    Listened to who exactly?

    Anonymous people on the internet who use vague & unexplained terms in their posts in order to add to their mystique.
    "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

  40. #125
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    The fact that you have to go to the Leb or Mali to be issued with boots that don't have steel toe caps says it all. Even then, it's a pair of poxy Magnum's you're issued with.

    It's now at the stage where, if you want to have a pair of boots that won't destroy your feet when you're out on the ground, you have to buy them yourself. It's a disgrace.

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