Around 1,300 soldiers receiving supplementary welfare payments - PDFORRA

[Rhodes]

Around 1,300 soldiers receiving supplementary welfare payments - PDFORRA

Around 1,300 members of the Defence Forces are receiving supplementary social welfare payments, according to their representative association.

PDFORRA, which represents soldiers, sailors and air force personnel, said around 20% of its members are on family income supplement because they cannot support their families on their current wages.

The association said Defence Forces personnel have taken cuts of up to 20% in their salaries.

Association President Mark Scally told the PDFORRA annual conference in Wexford today that it was nonsensical to first cut pay only to then hand the money back in the guise of social welfare.

The association also said that the Defence Forces do not have sufficient personnel or resources to carry out its duties.

It pointed to the fact that three out of the eight naval service vessels are being repaired and out of service.

Minister for Defence Alan Shatter is due to address the conference this evening.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/1002/477797-defence-forces/

[RoyalGreenJacket]

That's really unfortunate for individuals.

[Rhodes]

Soldiers furious over end to medical subsidy

SOLDIERS are up in arms over a decision by Defence Minister Alan Shatter to end low-cost medical services for their comrades based at the Curragh.

The troops say the service has been in place for more than a century and accuse the minister of breaching the Haddington Road deal with the public sector.

The issue was raised last night at the opening of the annual conference of Pdforra, the association representing soldiers, sailors and aircrew in the Defence Forces, in Wexford town.

An angry Simon Devereux, who is association deputy general secretary, said: "It beggars belief that the Department of Defence has unilaterally discontinued this service to families in the Curragh at a time when they are finding it so difficult to make ends meet and in a manner contrary to the agreement".

SURPRISED

Mr Devereux said this decision had been taken without negotiation and directly breached the Haddington Road deal.

"We are surprised and deeply concerned that this insensitive and unacceptable move has the support of Mr Shatter".

He called on the minister to review and reverse the decision as a matter of urgency.

Mr Devereux said the low-cost service had been available to soldiers' families for well over a century and abolishing it at a time of immense hardship was not only unacceptable but unnecessary.

He pointed out that his members had accepted the Haddington Road agreement by a vote of three to one following a national ballot and would continue to abide by its side of the deal.

Mr Shatter is due to address the conference this afternoon on a range of issues being raised by delegates.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/soldiers-furious-over-end-to-medical-subsidy-29626581.html

[Fridge Magnet]

Considering the new payscales for new Pte's that PDFORRA managed to help come up with, they haven't a leg to stand on when it comes to cribbing about lads claiming FIS.

[apod]

PDFORRA did no such thing.They recommended acceptance of a bitter pill forced on us by the departmental side in a effort to prevent having to swallow an even bigger shit sandwich which would have royally f****d our existing membership and their families.

[RoyalGreenJacket]

surely the figures are wrong on this - otherwise it means about 10% of Ireland's armed forces are so poorly paid that they are receiving supplementary social welfare payments???

is someone just bigging up the figures to make a case here or what?

I don't believe ONH's pay and conditions are that bad.

[DeV]

What PDFORRA isn't saying is that FIS is based AFAIK on net income.

The USC and PSPL make a big impact on net pay.

I could be wrong but there has also been 10% cut in basic pay and many allowances.

FIS is also only paid to families (ie must have at least 1 child), open to correction by neither parent can be on the dole?!

Which would mean that the soldiers generally would have either quite a large family and/or the partner is getting only €100-200 per week (depending on the size of the family).

Thankfully (or not) I don't know a lot about FIS so the above is open to correction.

[Barry]

Thankfully (or not) I don't know a lot about FIS so the above is open to correction.

If only there was a search engine which you could type "Family Income Supplement" into, and find out everything you need to know: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en...upplement.html

The FIS threshold for 1 child is €506 per week, and according to the Haddington Road document (http://cdn.thejournal.ie/media/2013/...haddington.pdf) the highest weekly pay rate for Ptes is €498.42 - before tax, USC and the pension levy.

[apod]

Most of the lads I know who are on FIS have three and four kids.Their wives are not working.It's a disgrace that would not be allowed happen to any other nations soldiers!!

[Goldie fish]

Most of the lads I know who are on FIS have three and four kids.Their wives are not working.It's a disgrace that would not be allowed happen to any other nations soldiers!!

You could find that many other nations who have poorly paid soldiers, if not tinpot dictatorships, also provide accommodation for the soldiers and their families, sometimes "on camp". The practice of "married quarters" here seems to have passed for cost reasons, without paying any thought for the welfare of those who would previously have been accommodated. The Gardaí still have "garda houses" available to whoever needs them, for short periods. They are maintained by OPW, and rent is deducted at source.

[Craghopper]

If only there was a search engine which you could type "Family Income Supplement" into, and find out everything you need to know: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en...upplement.html

The FIS threshold for 1 child is €506 per week, and according to the Haddington Road document (http://cdn.thejournal.ie/media/2013/...haddington.pdf) the highest weekly pay rate for Ptes is €498.42 - before tax, USC and the pension levy.

And it's 60% of the difference, depending on how many Children you have

[Rhodes]

20% of Defence Forces personnel affected by poverty - PDFORRA

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1001/649119-pdforra-conference/

[ODIN]

Imagine how water charges are going to add to that poverty.

[hptmurphy]

I'm sceptical in how PDFORRA are selling this.

The DF have suffered the same paycuts and levies as the rest of the public service.

I earn the same as a CPO or CS, I don't have access to premium, my money is the same every week, but I live within my means, my mortgage gets paid, I drive a 5 year old car, which I don't have to sleep in.

Given both my wife and myself are public sector employees we both suffered cuts in wages , double that of a lot of serving soldiers.

The persons involved made lifestyle choices that seem to be at odds with the occupation they chose. The army should never have allowed the situation to arise where people would come off a 24 hour duty and have to drive long distances to get home. If commuting wasn't feasible soldiers should have been offered accomadation in bks at modest rates and they travel to see their familes in their time off. Its a reality for many in civvie street as well.

The Df are paid comparably with many others in the public service , so the problem is not unique to the DF, just PDFORRA have chosen to represent it as such.

A three star private driving a new car living in a 300k house having two holidays per anum....its quite common place, or maybe its the FIS paying for it!

[DeV]

Most privates (who have children and who have no other family income) would qualify for FIS based on the 2008 pay rates (never mind 2010).

Is the issue not that the other parent isn't working?

On the sleeping in cars etc:
I've met people who commute Dublin to Athlone, it may overtime work itself out (either by people moving house or leaving). But unfortunately the PDF are in a position where they signed up to be moved complusaryily. Some kind of expenses should be given and time allowed to make arrangements to move. The issue with this that say someone who used to be in Clonmel, is stationed in Kilkenny but lives in Cork, say they move to Kilkenny. What if Kilkenny is closed and they are posted to the Curragh/Cork.