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  • Bin them

    Bin them


    off load them , don't need this type in the DF.
    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

  • #2
    Thugs!
    Cry "havoc!", and let slip the dogs of war!

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    • #3
      they are guilty of 'violent disorder'.

      boys will be boys.

      give them a severe reprimand and let them soldier on i say.
      Last edited by RoyalGreenJacket; 29 November 2013, 10:09.
      RGJ

      ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

      The Rifles

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      • #4
        So we train men to operate at the extremes of human ferocity, but then get upset when that "controlled aggression" spills over in a nightclub after a few drinks? This is an isolated incident and not representative of the Defence Forces proper after all.

        By all means punish them internally, apply corrective action, but binning them is just counter-productive.
        Last edited by SwiftandSure; 29 November 2013, 10:11.

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        • #5
          He kicked a lad when he was on the deck. Lowest of the low.

          Ignore the fact he's a soldier, he should be locked up for that alone
          To close with and kill the enemy in all weather conditions, night and day and over any terrain

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          • #6
            Originally posted by HavocIRL View Post
            He kicked a lad when he was on the deck. Lowest of the low.

            Ignore the fact he's a soldier, he should be locked up for that alone
            I'm not saying they're not pricks for doing it. They are. But when you consider their profession trains them to bayonet wounded people on the deck who may still be considered a threat, the occasional unsavoury act like this will happen.

            If it were up to me, I'd beast these guys for the next 2 months solid. Rock around the clock. Painting Rocks. Marching in quick time everywhere. PT twice daily. Death by press ups. Inspection, inspection, inspection. The works.

            If "the army is their life" as they stated in court, then they'll take it on the chin, will never do it again, and the end product will be a better soldier.

            If they think it's unfair treatment, then bin them.

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            • #7
              Sending them to prison would achieve nothing, but would cost the taxpayer thousands, while sacking them would mean increased spending on welfare.


              Its important to note that its not alleged that they started it, the other two and the woman seem equally culapable. As for kicking somebody on the ground, my experience of fighting has always been jailhouse rules, not marquess of Queensbury.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by SwiftandSure View Post
                I'm not saying they're not pricks for doing it. They are. But when you consider their profession trains them to bayonet wounded people on the deck who may still be considered a threat, the occasional unsavoury act like this will happen.

                If it were up to me, I'd beast these guys for the next 2 months solid. Rock around the clock. Painting Rocks. Marching in quick time everywhere. PT twice daily. Death by press ups. Inspection, inspection, inspection. The works.

                If "the army is their life" as they stated in court, then they'll take it on the chin, will never do it again, and the end product will be a better soldier.

                If they think it's unfair treatment, then bin them.
                Soldiers are also supposed to be disciplined. Behaving like this does not display any sense of discipline.

                To try and justify it as they are trained soldiers is only looking at one side of the coin. If a soldier is not disciplined enough to not go getting into fights then they are not the type of soldier I want to serve with.

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                • #9
                  Yeah I'm with the beasting and RTU option.

                  Nothing to suggest that they started the fight and kicking someone when they're down is a. Context dependent and b. Easy to do with a rush of sh*t to the head.

                  They don't appear to have stamped anyone into a pulp drive-style.
                  "It is a general popular error to imagine that loudest complainers for the public to be the most anxious for it's welfare" Edmund Burke

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
                    they are guilty of 'violent disorder'.

                    boys will be boys.

                    give them a severe reprimand and let them soldier on i say.
                    Attacking people without reason, hitting women & continuing to assault someone when they've gone to the ground is far removed from 'boyish' antics; it's downright thuggery. Would you be as dismissive of what happened & as quick to forgive if it had been your wife or daughter who'd been assaulted?
                    "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by paul g View Post
                      It's important to note that its not alleged that they started it, the other two and the woman seem equally culapable. As for kicking somebody on the ground, my experience of fighting has always been jailhouse rules, not marquess of Queensbury.
                      If the other parties had been equally culpable then they would also have been charged; the fact that they weren't means no one has any business casting dispersions on them. There was no evidence given as to who started it, but the fact that they pled guilty to a lesser charge while the more serious ones were not pursued is very telling.

                      No one should get a free pass from proper punishment on the basis of what they do for a living.
                      "The dolphins were monkeys that didn't like the land, walked back to the water, went back from the sand."

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                      • #12
                        There are a number of factors which may or should be considerd in sentancing.
                        1. The extent of injuries of the vicims (bruised skin and ego or broken bones)
                        2. The genuine remorse and likelihood of re-offending.
                        3. The compensation paid by the defendents (i.e. did they pick up the hospital bills, contribute to loss of earnings if the victims had to take time off work).
                        4. Whether or not they initiated the fight (who threw the first punch, not who mouthed off first).

                        Most people if they got into a fight in the street and it was sufficiently not serious enough to warrant a suspended sentance or fine then you probably will not loose your job (note probably). That all being said just because the judge gives them a light sentance does not mean that the military won't take a dimmer view of this incident.

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                        • #13
                          The DF teaches discipline and controlled aggression.

                          The parties in each case don't show either.

                          I assume either way it would reflect on they annual report - their chances of promotion, overseas and extending contracts.

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                          • #14
                            Puts the prickly affair into context.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I know one of the lads involved really well. He is actually a family man who takes the job more seriously than most. While what he did was horrible its also really out of character for him. To bin them would make an already bad situation even worse

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