Ministerial Air Transport Service

[Victor]

I was actually thinking the other week why do they do each rotation as a separate tender

Air operators may not be able to fit the flexibility required without adding a substantial financial premium.

[cpxxx]

No mention of AA ops.

AA ops wouldn't fall into the criteria of this tender. That would require a more specialist operator of which there are several. Perhaps there is a separate tender in preparation?

If the Air Corps loses the MATS service. It makes no sense to retain the aircraft just for AA operations. It also doesn't make sense financially or logistically to have both the Air Corps and a civilian operator providing MATS services. It does appear that they Air Corps will lose the job. The tender is specific

from qualified and duly certified JAR OPS/EASAcarriers including recognised national flag carriers/operators.

. The Air Corps does not qualify on that basis thus cannot bid.

While this is not good news for the Air Corps. It is common sense and it was all but inevitable.

[almaza]

This will have no effect on the Air Corps Ministerial Air Transport role. The contract is to carry large delegations with heavy baggage which is outside the capacity of the Gulfstream IV.

[Helihead]

Maybe this be the start of privatising some IAC operations, as mentioned by a Sunday newspaper earlier in the year.

[Tadpole]

Now, what was that I mentioned a long time ago?

Oh, yes, get focused on military operations or die a long slow lingering death. So, the death of a thousand cuts begins. Even if this isn't aimed purely at MATS, it soon will be if it shows savings and operational promise. Time for that wake up call.

[DeV]

Air operators may not be able to fit the flexibility required without adding a substantial financial premium.

This tender isn't the run of the mill one, it is to create a panel of 5 operators that can be used (like having an account with them).

This will have no effect on the Air Corps Ministerial Air Transport role. The contract is to carry large delegations with heavy baggage which is outside the capacity of the Gulfstream IV.

From 8 people so it remains to be scene, it says 40 on average.


DF overseas MEDEVACs are covered by this.

[Helihead]

This will have no effect on the Air Corps Ministerial Air Transport role. The contract is to carry large delegations with heavy baggage which is outside the capacity of the Gulfstream IV.

I suggest you read sec 2.1.5.3 of the tender document.

[almaza]

I suggest you read sec 2.1.5.3 of the tender document.

There is no "sec 2.1.5.3".

[ropebag]

...Even if this isn't aimed purely at MATS, it soon will be if it shows savings and operational promise. Time for that wake up call.

i think the wake-up call was some time ago, this is the start of the fire sale.

the govt has taken the plunge with this tender, i doubt than anything short of a miracle will see the AC keep any of the current roles it undertakes - i think that this is the big red flag that says that the DoD and wider government has not just lost confidence with the AC, but lost confidence to the extent that they're prepared to do something sufficiently radical that Sir Humphrey would call it 'couragous'.

now, it is possible that this is the DoD offloading all those crap roles and moulding the AC into the steely-eyed dealers of death - or, at least being available after 3pm on a Friday - that the Army and NS needs to provide support to their operations, but i wouldn't bet much on it.

the truth is there's not one role that the AC undertakes that isn't being done over the water by a civilian contractor - the AC appears to have cut its own throat by civilianising everything about itself except the price tag and the flexibility rather than carving out a niche role that no civilian contractor could do.

[almaza]

i think the wake-up call was some time ago, this is the start of the fire sale.

the govt has taken the plunge with this tender, i doubt than anything short of a miracle will see the AC keep any of the current roles it undertakes - i think that this is the big red flag that says that the DoD and wider government has not just lost confidence with the AC, but lost confidence to the extent that they're prepared to do something sufficiently radical that Sir Humphrey would call it 'couragous'.

now, it is possible that this is the DoD offloading all those crap roles and moulding the AC into the steely-eyed dealers of death - or, at least being available after 3pm on a Friday - that the Army and NS needs to provide support to their operations, but i wouldn't bet much on it.

the truth is there's not one role that the AC undertakes that isn't being done over the water by a civilian contractor - the AC appears to have cut its own throat by civilianising everything about itself except the price tag and the flexibility rather than carving out a niche role that no civilian contractor could do.

The Air Corps has never carried out the tasks that this tender needs filled because they never had a aircraft large enough.

[Helihead]

There is no "sec 2.1.5.3".

Yes there is. Go to the full notice text, you will find it there.

[Helihead]

The Air Corps has never carried out the tasks that this tender needs filled because they never had a aircraft large enough.

It's open to one or multiple operaters, I believe air ambulance also gets a mention in the tender. Looks like troika have their sights set...excuse the pun.

[Pure Hover]

Interesting that it's not the DoD sticking the knife into the AC this time but a Dept. that can't even afford to pay its Gardai. The AC can easily carry out all these tasks with the right aircraft and maybe they should tender for it unless of course they're PREVENTED from tendering for it and the State ends up paying €523 million for the service

[pym]

the truth is there's not one role that the AC undertakes that isn't being done over the water by a civilian contractor - the AC appears to have cut its own throat by civilianising everything about itself except the price tag and the flexibility rather than carving out a niche role that no civilian contractor could do.

Genuinely interested - Which civvi organisations in the UK lift 105mm guns & crews into position for the army, transport special forces, are equipped for fast roping, offer armed light air support, etc?

Cheers

[danno]

No mention of carriage of Taoiseach/Tainiste in doc ?