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  1. #26
    Brigadier General
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    Quote Originally Posted by easyrider View Post
    If they're spending €5 million a year keeping the Gulfstream flying, would it be more cost-effective to spend that money leasing something like the Airbus A319 - which could also be used as a long-range troop transport, as was mentioned earlier? Anyone know about leasing costs?

    Could be an A319ACJ on the market in the near future: apparently the one operated by the French Air Force isn't big enough for Sarkozy (and his ego), so they're buying a secondhand A330. The DF are well in with the French, aren't they......



    Just for comparison, this is what other countries do for VIP air transport: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_tra...and_government
    My God, what a day?
    First young BO gets elected President of the good ol' yewsssofa and then.. . . . . .
    easyrider makes a post I can [almost] agree with.
    "We will hold out until our last bullet is spent. Could do with some whiskey"
    Radio transmission, siege of Jadotville DR Congo. September 1961.
    Illegitimi non carborundum

  2. #27
    Commandant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turkey View Post
    My God, what a day?
    First young BO gets elected President of the good ol' yewsssofa and then.. . . . . .
    easyrider makes a post I can [almost] agree with.
    Oh s**t, where did I go wrong???

    Or maybe it is the dawn of a new age.....

  3. #28
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    Govt Ministers do use scheduled flights a lot of the time (including Ryanair). But thats less press worthy than stories about the Govt jet.

  4. #29
    Lt General Barry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmtts View Post
    Over here 32 Squadron are flying the Royals less and less these days.
    Only because the Royals have taken up flying themselves around

  5. #30
    Colonel pmtts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    Only because the Royals have taken up flying themselves around
    Yes and no to that question. :wink:

  6. #31
    Tim Horgan Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Another snag?

    Martin flight delayed by hydraulic leak
    Friday, 21 November 2008 19:50

    Minister for Foreign Affairs Micheál Martin has had his return trip from Georgia delayed due to a technical problem on the Government jet.

    The jet, which has recently been refurbished, is being checked for a hydraulic leak.

    The Government delegation had been due to leave before lunchtime today but the leak delayed their departure and they are now scheduled to leave for Ireland later tonight.

    The Minister had been holding talks with the Georgian government.

    Minister Martin met Irish members of the EU military monitoring mission around the disputed boundary area between Georgia and the two break-away enclaves of Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

    He has also met ethnic Georgian refugees who are still unable to return to their villages following alleged ethnic cleansing by pro-Russian South Ossetian militia.


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  7. #32
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com...ad.php?t=14483

    What is the writers point?

    This is normal maintainance that the AC doesn't have the capability to complete.

    Thought IMHO they should consider leasing giving the ecomonic pressure we are under.

  8. #33
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    Somebody wants these stories to be in the media, so as the prepare/influence public opinion and/or put pressure on decision-makers. Either the Air Corps, the Taoiseach and/or Govt. Ministers, or companies that fancy their chances of selling us an aircraft.

    Journalists are basically lazy and tend to hunt in packs. PR companies know this - many of them are ex-journalists - so they create stories and often do the actual writing, or else they arrange 'leaks' or 'exclusives'.

    So treat what you read/see/hear in the media with a great deal of cynicism. Bottom-line is "whose interests are served by this story?"

  9. #34
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    Buy a QC. Takes Cargo, Troops or VIPs dependent on what you fit.

    Current completed cost is about €13.5m or 1.3 per yr over a standard 10 years.
    That leaves €3.7 mil to operate the aircraft and dosent even include the saving made by not having to charter troop rotations and cargo flights to hot sunny spots. Surely even the Air Corps could stay within that budget

  10. #35
    Gunner concussion's Avatar
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    I am shocked and appalled at the work they are putting into keeping this heap of junk in the air - sure it was only a year ago that it underwent annual maintenance....
    "Attack your attic with a Steyr....as seen on the Late Late Show..."

  11. #36
    Tim Horgan Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Never let facts get in the way of a sensationalist headline.

    http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/sh...x?ID=JAN111820

    Title: GIV Annual Maintenance, Engine Mid-Life Maintenance & Repaint
    Published by: Air Corps Contracts Section
    Publication Date: 20/01/2009
    Application Deadline: 20/02/2009
    Notice Deadline Date: 02/03/2009
    Notice Deadline Time: 12:00
    Notice Type: Contract Notice
    Has Documents: Yes
    Abstract: Gulfstream IV Annual Maintenance to be completed by July 2009.The completion of engine mid-life maintenance on one Gulfstream IV Tay Engine, with an option for a second engine.Full repaint on the Gulfstream IV aircraft, to be completed during August 2009.
    CPV: 50211000.
    Aircraft undergo maintenance... Big deal!


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  12. #37
    Commandant Jetjock's Avatar
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    I think easyrider has a point. Somebody is buttering up the public for a new plane and the papers are lapping it up.

  13. #38
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    258 on a recent trip to Madrid
    Last edited by Fireplace; 15th May 2009 at 21:29.
    You will never have a quiet world until you knock the patriotism out of the human race

  14. #39
    The Gaffer Boomer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fireplace View Post






    258 on a visit to Madrid
    Fireplace, those images are blocked, can you upload them to another server and relink?

  15. #40
    Sergeant Major Thorpe's Avatar
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    258 likes to get around, it was parked on the ramp outside the airport fire station in Cork airport this evening after making a flawless landing, have to admit it did look well on the app to 35, no pictures as the camera died on me earlier
    Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato

    "Where there is no guidance the people fall, but in abundance of counselors there is victory" Proverbs 11-14
    http://munsterfireandrescue.com

  16. #41
    Tim Horgan Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Sounds to me like spin..

    Government jet doubles as air ambulance six times in year
    Wednesday, August 19, 2009 - 01:41 PM



    A Government jet has been transformed into an air ambulance six times this year for critical medical missions, it emerged today.

    The Defence Forces revealed its Air Corps has been involved in 44 urgent cases in recent months.

    In the last week alone a sick child was flown from England to Our Lady’s Hospital Crumlin while lifesaving organs have also been transported between hospitals.

    The Defence Forces said the Health Service Executive (HSE) requests a crew when time and speed is critical for saving a life.

    “The Air Corps gives the HSE an option that can save lives,” said Captain Pat O’Connor, Defence Forces spokesman.

    “In these operations, most of the time, the critical factor is time.

    “They can move people fast, safely and without the need for these patients to move through commercial flights and airports.”

    Aircraft are quickly fitted with full life support equipment and a medic brought on board.
    Records show the Air Corps, which is on standby 24 hours a day, completed: 133 flying hours on medical cases so far this year.

    Missions included eight neo-natal cases, 11 organ retrievals and 25 inter hospital transfers.

    The Government Learjet was used six times, the maritime patrol Casa plane in nine cases, and the AW139 helicopter 24 times.

    Last year more than 250 hours of flying time were completed in 87 air ambulance missions, which included removing two injured people from islands.

    While this civil community support has been ongoing for years, a formal agreement signed with the Department of Health and Children in November 2007 covers the emergency transfer of patients between hospitals in Ireland and the UK.

    Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children in London is a frequent destination.

    The Air Corps said it covers a wide range of roles including Presidential and ministerial transport, Garda air support, and military transport.

    Elsewhere, it is on standby for major incidents, like the Navan bus crash a couple of years ago where a number of helicopters were offered but were not subsequently needed.

    The Learjet can also be used for strategic evacuations on military missions abroad.



    Read more: http://www.examiner.ie/breakingnews/...#ixzz0OdPrqU8f
    They say "the government jet" as if there is only one. In effect there is 2(previously 3) dedicated Government fixed wing aircraft. They seem to be trying hard to turn the Casa into one too, if the figures for use are anything to go by.

    Not surprising that this would be allowed, given the GOC AC is ex MATS pilot.
    Last edited by Goldie fish; 19th August 2009 at 14:27.


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  17. #42
    dutymachine spud's Avatar
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    In fairness there are alot of air ambulance flights out of the don!

    The casa's and lear are usually used and ive also saw the 139s at it aswell!

  18. #43
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    The CASA was being used for MATS missions.

  19. #44
    Retired sapper smegers's Avatar
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    I didn't know the CASA could take passengers. Isn't it full of surveillance equipment?

  20. #45
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    There is a small rest area for crew (I think it has airline type seats).

    They were used to bring civil servants to Belfast just after the GFA.

  21. #46
    Commander-in-Chief futurepilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    There is a small rest area for crew (I think it has airline type seats).

    They were used to bring civil servants to Belfast just after the GFA.
    Yeah mission equipment is in the back half, few seats in the front bit.
    Education isn't everything, for a start it isn't an elephant

  22. #47
    Commandant Jetjock's Avatar
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    Behind the flight deck there is a galley and maybe 6 airline type seats-it's been a while since I was in Baldonnel.

    The last time I was in a Casa was at Fairford about 4/5 years ago and one of the comments made was the way the mission equipment and operators stations were fitted was a barrier to the use of the aircraft for anything much more than the mission they were intended for.

    The problem was that the station(s) were fitted facing the side of the aircraft and not the more traditional (and obvious) forward facing. This caused a problem in that the mission fit, not being palletised, could not be removed without great dificulty, meaning that the aircraft could not be used for an emergency transport op, for example a resupply of a peacekeeping deployment.

    Has this problem been rectified with the upgrade?

  23. #48
    Orpheus WES's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smegers View Post
    I didn't know the CASA could take passengers. Isn't it full of surveillance equipment?
    Someone may correct me on this but I'm sure Mary Harney requisitioned the Casa a number of years ago to airlift her fat a*** to open an off-licence in Longford. Any takers?
    The worst sin toward our fellow creatures is not to hate them, but to be indifferent to them: that's the essence of inhumanity.
    (George Bernard Shaw, Playwright, 1856 - 1950)

  24. #49
    Tim Horgan Goldie fish's Avatar
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    Was it a friend of her now husbands offie too? And the State car drove from dublin to meet her at the airport.


    Catch-22 says they have a right to do anything we can't stop them from doing.

  25. #50
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    Hi there
    The mission equipment in the Casa was allegedly removable in two hours but that bore no relation to reality.I know because we tried! The old Casa, 250, was great for medevacs because every thing could be carried up the ramp and secured. Those medical teams carry a huge amount of gear, not to mention the bed or incubator of the patient, which takes up a huge amount of space.When the maritime Casa were used, in my time,for medevacs, it was common for kit to be stowed back in the mission space and even back as far as the ramp. The time is long overdue for a cargo aircraft to be bought for medevacs if the State still feels the need to do them. I don't see the RAF using Nimrods for medevacs any time soon....
    regards
    GttC

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