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  • #46
    i've been on a NATO exercise in Poland (Drawsko Pomorskie) with German 155 SPG's doing the business, didn't seem to be any problems then, though apparently they were verboten from mentioning that it used to be in Germany...

    there seems to be some confusion over the definition of training areas - the stuff where we used to bomb around ripping up roads, crashing into houses, tearing up crops and throwing claim forms out the back of the AS90's wasn't on training areas, it was on civi owned fields that the German government had recieved permission for us to train on or public roads - training areas are military owned ranges where you drive where you like and blow shit up willy-nilly.

    very large training areas are rare in Europe, Salisbury Training Area is one of the biggest (actually, i think it is the biggest..), and full on Bn group manouver warfare with Cav, lots of Artillery and CAS/AH while perfectly doable on an area that size, does benefit from a larger stage... Sennybridge, six times the size of the Glen of Imaal, is less than half the size of Salisbury Plain...

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    • #47
      Originally posted by DeV View Post
      Poland doesn't have a problem with the Brits unless things have changed
      Poland is terrified of Putins Russia, They want to embed themselves deeply in NATO and EU. so as to make Putin think twice about retaking land.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Schmigs View Post
        Is there really a need to go as far as Canada. Anywhere in Eastern Europe would have some very big open training plains.
        Irish personal have being on the Salisbury TA this summer

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        • #49
          Originally posted by na grohmití View Post
          With the associated political difficulties. The people of mainland Europe are a bit funny about having foreign armies having war games on their turf when it was in living memory when most of them saw real wars taking place there.
          After what the people on the continent went though in WW2 I would have though they would be reassured to see a NATO army. But then again there are a lot of crusties, who would have no memory of war and there fore do not see the need for a Army.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by sofa View Post
            Irish personal have being on the Salisbury TA this summer
            go on....
            RGJ

            ...Once a Rifleman - Always a Rifleman... Celer et Audax

            The Rifles

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            • #51
              Originally posted by RoyalGreenJacket View Post
              go on....
              All Arms course

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              • #52
                Coveney may send troops to fight pirates

                Defence Minister Simon Coveney is examining proposals to send Irish troops to the Indian Ocean to battle piracy as part of plans to expand peacekeeping missions abroad.

                The proposed mission is being costed at present and would form part of a likely greater spend on the Defence Forces in the run-up to the next budget.

                In an interview with the Irish Examiner, Mr Coveney said a number of new missions were being considered ahead of the long-awaited white paper on the future of the Defence Forces.

                “If we want to make a bigger impression on peacekeeping away from home and if we have a more comprehensive job to do at home here, in terms of our capacity to respond to defence challenges, well then that takes resources and I’ll fight for that,” he said.

                “We’re looking at various things. We’re costing what might cost us [to send] a ship to Operation Atalanta, an anti-piracy project off Somalia at the moment.

                “It’s no secret that I would like the Naval Service to have an opportunity to make a positive opportunity abroad. Not just because they could do a good job but because they could learn a lot from it.”

                Operation Atalanta is an EU-led counter-piracy operation run off the coast of Somalia in response to rising levels of armed robbery and kidnappings on vessels in the western Indian Ocean.

                Mr Coveney said his department’s white paper on the future of the Army would be finished by the summer.
                Defence Minister Simon Coveney is examining proposals to send Irish troops to the Indian Ocean to battle piracy as part of plans to expand peacekeeping missions abroad.

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                • #53
                  just me or does that sound like there is an outline schedule in place already?

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Orion View Post
                    just me or does that sound like there is an outline schedule in place already?
                    it looks that way to me - not just talking about ops, but talking about why those ops are beneficial to the state/population, and talking about the carve up of resources - that doesn't sould like politician spouting off in an unguarded moment, it sounds like politician talking about agreed policy.

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                    • #55
                      So.Just to speculate.What kind of assets could we see deployed?
                      Ship.Check.
                      ARW boarding teams.Probably('Cos the navy don't do SMG's)
                      Shore based NSE??Possibly.

                      Be good to see our NS getting to do OPS of this kind.Good transferable skills also for use in our waters.
                      "Let us be clear about three facts. First, all battles and all wars are won in the end by the infantryman. Secondly, the infantryman always bears the brunt. His casualties are heavier, he suffers greater extremes of discomfort and fatigue than the other arms. Thirdly, the art of the infantryman is less stereotyped and far harder to acquire in modern war than that of any other arm." ------- Field Marshall Wavell, April 1945.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by apod View Post
                        So.Just to speculate.What kind of assets could we see deployed?
                        Ship.Check.
                        ARW boarding teams.Probably('Cos the navy don't do SMG's)
                        Shore based NSE??Possibly.

                        Be good to see our NS getting to do OPS of this kind.Good transferable skills also for use in our waters.
                        Yup. And so the second of the three arms of the Defence Forces finally gets to show what it can do on the international stage

                        The NS could have been involved in this kind of operation a while ago. Doesn't UNIFIL have a maritime component at the moment (UNNAV or something like that)?

                        What next for the Air Corps?
                        "Well, stone me! We've had cocaine, bribery and Arsenal scoring two goals at home. But just when you thought there were truly no surprises left in football, Vinnie Jones turns out to be an international player!" (Jimmy Greaves)!"

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                        • #57
                          The NS have wanted to be involved in this from the outset, but DF HQ always blocked it.(i.e Army).
                          Interesting that it is only happening now that there are a few more voices not wearing green at the top table.

                          Anyone wanna place bets on the Air Corps going overseas too, though perhaps not with any aircraft?
                          For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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                          • #58
                            Given the way the NS is seen to be assisting the economy and the EDA, it could be assisting the push.

                            They are probably just looking at feasibility at the moment. Until they have to close more barracks to pay for it.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by DeV View Post
                              Given the way the NS is seen to be assisting the economy and the EDA, it could be assisting the push.

                              They are probably just looking at feasibility at the moment. Until they have to close more barracks to pay for it.
                              Pay for what? It would cost no more than any other UN mission, however the crew size would make it easily fit into our self imposed limits, while continuing our other overseas missions. We have already sent ships on overseas courtesy trips. The costs were measured in thousands of euro, not millions. The important consideration is that there are enough ships crewed and serviceable to continue the work at home.
                              For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by na grohmití View Post
                                Pay for what? It would cost no more than any other UN mission, however the crew size would make it easily fit into our self imposed limits, while continuing our other overseas missions. We have already sent ships on overseas courtesy trips. The costs were measured in thousands of euro, not millions. The important consideration is that there are enough ships crewed and serviceable to continue the work at home.
                                It is an EU mission not UN, therefore the Irish taxpayer has the foot the bill:
                                - fuel (to/from AO, patrolling etc)
                                - rations
                                - ammo
                                - rotation flights
                                - if you send an NSE and/or additional crew there accommodation etc costs
                                - overseas allowances
                                Etc

                                Overseas PSO Allowance - Seaman - €61.27 daily
                                Overseas Armed PSO Allowance - €22.58 daily

                                Assuming a crew of 44 for a 12 month deployment (the crews (and possibly the vessel) would be rotated in that time:
                                Over €1.3 million in Overseas PSO & Overseas Armed PSO allowances alone

                                Plus the various naval allowances (it would be another €0.8 million in PDA).

                                The above figures are based on the amount paid to a Seaman (higher rates are paid to NCOs and officers).

                                Plus the NS is over 5% under its permitted strength

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