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  • #91
    Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post
    These restructurings are caused by reduced numbers. It is also hastened by barrack movs. It will also be affected by required mobility, especially if you use terms like immediate and strike. In the old days they had the 16th Air Assault Brigade ( my son had the privilige of being it's BSM). How will new units be deployed with their hardware-sea-air-land ? and how do the Marines fit in to the offensive picture, or is it all cutbacks?
    They are caused by the need to reduce cost

    The point, in the context of this, is that the head of the army used a video on Twitter to communicate directly to his soldiers

    They also occasionally use their YouTube channel.

    It’s a comms tool, yes everyone in the world can see it but it means everyone in the intended audience can access it, unlike the “town halls” where everyone available in a particular location is invited to attend to hear the senior staff speak and ask questions.

    Comment


    • #92
      Originally posted by DeV View Post
      They are caused by the need to reduce cost

      The point, in the context of this, is that the head of the army used a video on Twitter to communicate directly to his soldiers

      They also occasionally use their YouTube channel.

      It’s a comms tool, yes everyone in the world can see it but it means everyone in the intended audience can access it, unlike the “town halls” where everyone available in a particular location is invited to attend to hear the senior staff speak and ask questions.
      I think social media is a great tool being honest. I have watched a few of the youtube and twitter videos put out by senior personnel in the British Army over the last year and while you should take it with a pinch of salt and not be naive; they do seem more direct and straight to the point actually responding to some of the big issues facing the force. Now it is all heavily filtered but better than nothing.

      The DF here are doing a lot lately but it would be great to see us move beyond the (impressive to be fair) videos of soldiers/sailors/airmen in action with exciting music in the background to something more substantial for the benefit of those already in.

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by Auldsod View Post
        I think social media is a great tool being honest. I have watched a few of the youtube and twitter videos put out by senior personnel in the British Army over the last year and while you should take it with a pinch of salt and not be naive; they do seem more direct and straight to the point actually responding to some of the big issues facing the force. Now it is all heavily filtered but better than nothing.

        The DF here are doing a lot lately but it would be great to see us move beyond the (impressive to be fair) videos of soldiers/sailors/airmen in action with exciting music in the background to something more substantial for the benefit of those already in.
        And of course the audience (intended or not) isn’t just those seeking a career in the DF

        The public, politicians and others (DoD don’t have interest in the DF so they don’t) watch it. She what the job entails, what the DF do on a day to day basis.

        COS had a speech that he has delivered countless times to countless various audiences on YouTube a few years ago. Excellent speech if only DoD would resource it.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by Auldsod View Post
          Your son must have had quite the career. 16 AA brigade is still a going concern is it not? Just no more Royal Irish involvement as in Iraq 2003.
          He had despite being Royal Corps of Signals 216 (para). He was always a mainland soldier. Got commissioned as a QM but wilted as a bean counter . Retired to Europe. The 16th still has an address at Colchester but was always THE ONLY immediate unit for Rapid deployment. He did Afghanistan with them. The UK Army was bigger then but to upsize to a 3 brigade movable Division now is aspirational especially with Forces in Europe and in overseas training areas like Batuk and Canada.

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          • #95
            [QUOTE=hptmurphy;468993]Theoretically you could...... if you remove a lot of the structures that the older systems was built in and adjust and prove the systems of work before you attempt any change anything, but doing more with less shouldn't mean that you need to cut it to the bone.

            Often to make savings in the long term you need to spend cash in the short term, target the people you need to retain, up skill and pay them enough to stay on . And you certainly don't try to adjust how the thing is run during an episode of fiscal restriction. (Quote)

            I think also treating our dead retired comrades in an appropriate fashion is important. What kind of send off would you give a Senior Technical NCO that lived in the Garrison with his family ALL of his service life? His funeral was in the Garrison Church with all of his family present, a huge cortege of elderly retired comrades and their wives. A handful of elderly officers who were grateful for the many times the CHIEF fixed their electrics, other than a bearer party, where was the official service?For my own part I would have put the Base Flag at half mast while the funeral and service was in the Garrison. RIP PJ. ar Dheis De etc.

            Comment


            • #96
              [QUOTE=ancientmariner;471964]
              Originally posted by hptmurphy View Post
              Theoretically you could...... if you remove a lot of the structures that the older systems was built in and adjust and prove the systems of work before you attempt any change anything, but doing more with less shouldn't mean that you need to cut it to the bone.

              Often to make savings in the long term you need to spend cash in the short term, target the people you need to retain, up skill and pay them enough to stay on . And you certainly don't try to adjust how the thing is run during an episode of fiscal restriction. (Quote)

              I think also treating our dead retired comrades in an appropriate fashion is important. What kind of send off would you give a Senior Technical NCO that lived in the Garrison with his family ALL of his service life? His funeral was in the Garrison Church with all of his family present, a huge cortege of elderly retired comrades and their wives. A handful of elderly officers who were grateful for the many times the CHIEF fixed their electrics, other than a bearer party, where was the official service?For my own part I would have put the Base Flag at half mast while the funeral and service was in the Garrison. RIP PJ. ar Dheis De etc.
              By way of clarification the SNCO was retired aged 94 and a great-great-grandfather. Official Service representation was minimal and not of a send off variety.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post

                By way of clarification the SNCO was retired aged 94 and a great-great-grandfather. Official Service representation was minimal and not of a send off variety.
                I think the problem is, as the service gets younger, the link between serving and retired passes. I think it would be fair to say there are few left serving today, who served under you at any stage, which in my book is still relatively recently, let alone someone who may have retired from the service a Generation ago.
                The average service for officers at present seems to be 15 years, maybe 21 for Senior rates.
                During a past command the Island opened its doors frequetly to all exers, and their families, at least once a year, and not just to those who were members of one of the retirees associations. This seems to have passed out of favour with subsequent flag officers, and as a result the service may not be as open to those who served it in their prime.
                We don't treat our exers well in this state. Those in command have a priority to treat thos still serving as best they can, due to the lack of respect the state has for those still serving.
                At the end of the day, I assume their was a breakdown in communication somewhere, and the person whose job it would be to deal with this protocol, may have been unaware of what was happening in the Garrison Church, given that their duties could have taken them to the other end of the Garrison completely, presuming they were even ashore, such is the situation with double jobbing.
                For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

                Comment


                • #99
                  Good post Dev. Explains it very clearly...

                  Comment


                  • By way of clarification the SNCO was retired aged 94 and a great-great-grandfather. Official Service representation was minimal and not of a send off variety.
                    A lot of the problem being those who served with him are dead and buried and most of those in charge of such events have no idea who the man was.....but thats not to say he shouldn't be given the accolades he was entitled to at his rank.

                    The NS tends to be a more transient than the army where very few live their lives in the local area after minimal periods of service and indeed those who do stick around afterwards usually have retired after quite an amount of service have an affiliation to persons they have served with.

                    Now the issue of representation, funerals etc, Ireland has changed and a funeral may not be the vent it was in former years, I don't do them, not even for family , in my service days I hated them as I remember as a rating being detailed to attend funerals of people whom I had no knowledge of, just to 'represent the navy'.... I probably hated the deceased regardless of ever knowing them as a result.

                    IMHO, if the respects due are rendered by the service as laid down well and good, but the day of detailing people to attend funerals is long past and should remain so.

                    I attended the funeral of a relative of mine back in 2000 , a former Lt Cdr, and while there were some there who did respect him and were his friends, there were also a large portion in attendance who were checking he had actually died. The pall bearers were ratings standing around in the rain on a sunday morning who had absolutely no interest in the event.

                    Funerals are for the families, the deceased won't know!
                    Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by hptmurphy View Post
                      A lot of the problem being those who served with him are dead and buried and most of those in charge of such events have no idea who the man was.....but thats not to say he shouldn't be given the accolades he was entitled to at his rank.

                      The NS tends to be a more transient than the army where very few live their lives in the local area after minimal periods of service and indeed those who do stick around afterwards usually have retired after quite an amount of service have an affiliation to persons they have served with.

                      Now the issue of representation, funerals etc, Ireland has changed and a funeral may not be the vent it was in former years, I don't do them, not even for family , in my service days I hated them as I remember as a rating being detailed to attend funerals of people whom I had no knowledge of, just to 'represent the navy'.... I probably hated the deceased regardless of ever knowing them as a result.

                      IMHO, if the respects due are rendered by the service as laid down well and good, but the day of detailing people to attend funerals is long past and should remain so.

                      I attended the funeral of a relative of mine back in 2000 , a former Lt Cdr, and while there were some there who did respect him and were his friends, there were also a large portion in attendance who were checking he had actually died. The pall bearers were ratings standing around in the rain on a sunday morning who had absolutely no interest in the event ,

                      Funerals are for the families, the deceased won't know!
                      For all the reasons you mention, including inconvenience, the Services should honour their dead. It reflects ethos and demonstrates the nature of Service Life and honour due to those that served or are serving. Other Nations do it well and our service people should get their due honour specifically and annually.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post
                        For all the reasons you mention, including inconvenience, the Services should honour their dead. It reflects ethos and demonstrates the nature of Service Life and honour due to those that served or are serving. Other Nations do it well and our service people should get their due honour specifically and annually.
                        Those who died are remembered annually by various events held by the state and as these are state events they need the attendance of the various arms of the defence forces, no problem here.

                        But detailing youngfellas to attend funerals of former servicemen who served 40 years ago is a non runner. There may be volunteers or guys released from duties to attend certain events such as burials during the working day, again all fitting... but the day of a fifty two seater coach full of the various' courses' detailed to attend the funeral of someone they never heard of is wrong especially if the various ranks above them are more noticeable by their absence than their presence.
                        Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

                        Comment


                        • The American system is worth looking at, where all eligible veterans are entitled to a military funeral (and headstone). My brother in law (an ex National Guard chaplain) officiates at quite a few.

                          'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
                          'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
                          Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
                          He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
                          http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

                          Comment


                          • With all due respect to the dead, their families and their service it probably should be done

                            But there isn’t sufficient personnel to do current operational tasks without overburdening already underpaid and overburdened serving personnel with a resultant effect on retention

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by hptmurphy View Post
                              But detailing youngfellas to attend funerals of former servicemen who served 40 years ago is a non runner. There may be volunteers or guys released from duties to attend certain events such as burials during the working day, again all fitting... but the day of a fifty two seater coach full of the various' courses' detailed to attend the funeral of someone they never heard of is wrong especially if the various ranks above them are more noticeable by their absence than their presence.
                              I disagree with you, the provision of funeral honours to retired members is an important part of demonstrating respect for the service and goes someway to demonstrating to these youngfellas that they are part of a larger family. Even if they do not realise it at the time they will in later years. I have carried many a stranger's coffin while in uniform and it is really only now when I am off the age that relatives and friends begin to pop off that I realise the importance of such displays of respect are to the family. You should not be forgotten when your time in uniform is over.

                              Now the uniform representation does not have to be more than is required per the regulations.

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