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What solution would you propose to the shortage as reported? Is there enough PO CommOps? Could the ship have gone to sea without? Would the leading hand at that branch have been capable of carrying out the role?
There was a time when ComOpp was a useful skill in civvy street, many old naval comops went on to work for the Coast Guard, Port Control or Merchant marine back when all ships of a certain size required a radio officer.
With those positions no more, where are the skilled operators going now?
For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.
What solution would you propose to the shortage as reported? Is there enough PO CommOps? Could the ship have gone to sea without? Would the leading hand at that branch have been capable of carrying out the role?
There was a time when ComOpp was a useful skill in civvy street, many old naval comops went on to work for the Coast Guard, Port Control or Merchant marine back when all ships of a certain size required a radio officer.
With those positions no more, where are the skilled operators going now?
Severe shortage at LS rank too.
The ship cannot sail without an NCO.
ABs leaving to do any type of work
POs retire after 21 years (old contract) to work part time in other jobs locally.
Coast Guard is still an option but based in Dublin, Valentia and Malin.
Approx 10 15 ex NS currently working in the Coastguard CRS
The solution is simple, make seagoing financially attractive through an large increase in PDA.
At least €50 a day into the hand makes that a reality.
When you consider that a Private soldier earns €83 a day in Portlaoise Prison security duty, it should be equal to that for a sailor at sea.
This type of recruitment campaign is so over-designed that it is likely to be unsuccessful. The general educational qualifications are higher than for most people seeking to enter as officer cadets or for any rank, that is not a direct entry officer specialist. The effort seems to be geared towards getting cut glass fully technically trained personnel. The physical demands, Pass or Fail, are being made too early in the process rather than being achieved during a period of supervised initial training. I often feel that our organisation doesn't believe in taking the recruit and making that person the sailor you require. There is no avoiding type training on specific Naval Equipments and such students need a decent Higher Certificate in Electronics to absorb our training and then be willing to accept our standards of communal living.
This type of recruitment campaign is so over-designed that it is likely to be unsuccessful. The general educational qualifications are higher than for most people seeking to enter as officer cadets or for any rank, that is not a direct entry officer specialist. The effort seems to be geared towards getting cut glass fully technically trained personnel. The physical demands, Pass or Fail, are being made too early in the process rather than being achieved during a period of supervised initial training. I often feel that our organisation doesn't believe in taking the recruit and making that person the sailor you require. There is no avoiding type training on specific Naval Equipments and such students need a decent Higher Certificate in Electronics to absorb our training and then be willing to accept our standards of communal living.
This is DE for L/RRTs... there DF equivalent (non-DE) will have a level 7
This type of recruitment campaign is so over-designed that it is likely to be unsuccessful. The general educational qualifications are higher than for most people seeking to enter as officer cadets or for any rank, that is not a direct entry officer specialist. The effort seems to be geared towards getting cut glass fully technically trained personnel. The physical demands, Pass or Fail, are being made too early in the process rather than being achieved during a period of supervised initial training. I often feel that our organisation doesn't believe in taking the recruit and making that person the sailor you require. There is no avoiding type training on specific Naval Equipments and such students need a decent Higher Certificate in Electronics to absorb our training and then be willing to accept our standards of communal living.
I think we have become too focused on age profiles when it comes to recruiting technicians, whether as recruits or DEs.
For example, my neighbour returned from the US some years back, qualified as a motorcycle mechanic, unfortunately his US skills are not recognised here. So he, at 38, got started as an apprentice maintenance fitter at a nearby pharma. The DF would consider him too old. Big Pharma are delighted to have his mechanical skills to use in their facility, and will bear the cost of retraining him specific to their needs.
The RN has a similar scheme where those who may have had a trade in the past, are recruited at senior rates, and retrained to a Naval specific trade. I know of one former plumber who entered RN after training as a PO Weapons technician.
Increase the bottom line and you will attract and retain the right people.
For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.
This is DE for L/RRTs... there DF equivalent (non-DE) will have a level 7
It's actually could be quite a good opportunity if you're interested in a life with the DF.
Think about it, you complete your degree by the time you're 21. Maritime electronics experience is helpful but not required. If you join after say a year or two in the private sector, you would be 23 yo and on 45k plus a year including your tech pay. Now if you get up to PO within a year or two and then include your patrol duty which could be up to 9k a year, that's a great opportunity for a young graduate.
(Waiting for someone to tell me that they could earn 100k plus in private sector now within the same time frame!)
Sadly the private sector pay isn't as transparent as the public sector. Private sector unions jumping up and down when public sector entry level grades get raises that bring them within reach of the average industrial wage, ignoring that the PS worker has no opportunity for overtime or shift premium, and they will only see that money after 15 years at grade....and promotion will only see them earn an extra €50 per week...
For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.
Sadly the private sector pay isn't as transparent as the public sector. Private sector unions jumping up and down when public sector entry level grades get raises that bring them within reach of the average industrial wage, ignoring that the PS worker has no opportunity for overtime or shift premium, and they will only see that money after 15 years at grade....and promotion will only see them earn an extra €50 per week...
Very fair points. I think they are great terms to attract someone to the DF with but the issue is of course retention. Dangling the glittering prize of C/RRT doesn't quite hold up against the private sector with a number years experience!
Jeremy Hardy (RIP) put it best a few years ago, talking about staff shortage in hospitals, when he said “If the starting salary for Nurses was 50k a year, an awful lot of students doing Media Studies degrees would pick Nursing instead”.
Pay a wage that is attractive, then an organisation can take its pick.
'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
He died that's all. It was his unlucky night. http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html
I think we have become too focused on age profiles when it comes to recruiting technicians, whether as recruits or DEs.
For example, my neighbour returned from the US some years back, qualified as a motorcycle mechanic, unfortunately his US skills are not recognised here. So he, at 38, got started as an apprentice maintenance fitter at a nearby pharma. The DF would consider him too old. Big Pharma are delighted to have his mechanical skills to use in their facility, and will bear the cost of retraining him specific to their needs.
The RN has a similar scheme where those who may have had a trade in the past, are recruited at senior rates, and retrained to a Naval specific trade. I know of one former plumber who entered RN after training as a PO Weapons technician.
Increase the bottom line and you will attract and retain the right people.
But will not place the same physical or mental demands on him that the DF will/could
Sadly the private sector pay isn't as transparent as the public sector. Private sector unions jumping up and down when public sector entry level grades get raises that bring them within reach of the average industrial wage, ignoring that the PS worker has no opportunity for overtime or shift premium, and they will only see that money after 15 years at grade....and promotion will only see them earn an extra €50 per week...
I think you have an over inflated view of what the private sector gets BUT that is a topic for another thread.
I think you have an over inflated view of what the private sector gets BUT that is a topic for another thread.
Perhaps so. The mantra from Employer bodies is that the Public Service is payed too much , because their certainty of employment merits lesser rates of pay. However in our case most of us have had no increase other than adjustments caused by promotion or scale changes.
In most Services voluntary retirements are subject to a quota depending on skill sets and they in turn need months of notice. Example 3 CERA want to go but the quota for 2020 is used up, two may leave next year in June and the third must wait until 2022.
Experts agree that the median average is a better indicator of typical salaries, so why do policymakers always focus on the mean average? writes Felim O’Rourke
Take the below as an example. Most workers earn quite a bit below it but because it's a simple average, those earning very high salaries push it way up.
I'm sure a lot of people have left the PS and were shocked to discover that not all jobs attract over 50k.
Experts agree that the median average is a better indicator of typical salaries, so why do policymakers always focus on the mean average? writes Felim O’Rourke
Take the below as an example. Most workers earn quite a bit below it but because it's a simple average, those earning very high salaries push it way up.
I'm sure a lot of people have left the PS and were shocked to discover that not all jobs attract over 50k.
Reluctant to get drawn further off topic, but the average PS worker wage is very misleading, as it includes the earnings of the Taoiseach.
Nobody really leaves the PS....
For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.
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