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  • Originally posted by Laners View Post
    Arms drill manual to be amended to include baseball bats .
    Dan Harvey's book , Soldiering During the troubles, is interesting and gives a clear picture of the involvement of many that held or now hold office both North and South.
    The Naval actions off the SW Coast didn't stop one of the participants being elected and sitting in our Dail. I thought anyone with doubt in their CV were prohibited from putting their hands on the reins of power. The Dail members must be encouraged to give us a safe Government.

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    • Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post
      Dan Harvey's book , Soldiering During the troubles, is interesting and gives a clear picture of the involvement of many that held or now hold office both North and South.
      The Naval actions off the SW Coast didn't stop one of the participants being elected and sitting in our Dail. I thought anyone with doubt in their CV were prohibited from putting their hands on the reins of power. The Dail members must be encouraged to give us a safe Government.


      Looks like a good read...hadn't heard of this book before.
      'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

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      • Originally posted by spider View Post
        https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...t_bibl_vppi_i0

        Looks like a good read...hadn't heard of this book before.
        It was relatively recently published very good read

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        • Dan never disappoints.
          For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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          • Ordered it...arrives tomorrow
            'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

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            • Originally posted by spider View Post
              Ordered it...arrives tomorrow
              Well done. I must get a copy in Eason's. Apparently, I,m told, that the Good Friday Agreement gave them a plenary indulgence but they forget that most of us don't want to hear of their residual coercive aspirations while we are still floundering to repair our social structures.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by spider View Post
                Ordered it...arrives tomorrow
                I wouldn't have bothered..Its a very sterile book thick with political input and very little input from those on the ground appart for a few officers and one NCO, Like Harveys other book, tough going in places with detail that has been well reported else where.
                Covid 19 is not over ....it's still very real..Hand Hygiene, Social Distancing and Masks.. keep safe

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                • Originally posted by hptmurphy View Post
                  I wouldn't have bothered..Its a very sterile book thick with political input and very little input from those on the ground appart for a few officers and one NCO, Like Harveys other book, tough going in places with detail that has been well reported else where.
                  It's arrived...I'm on a FTX from Weds for a couple of weeks it's in my Bergan. Along with a copy of 'The Real Cruel Sea'...it's going to be a cold boring couple of weeks
                  'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

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                  • For some unknown reason, the book I always packed for exercises was “Pride and Prejudice”. Maybe because it was so at odds with what was going on in the real world.

                    Anyway, good luck and enjoy
                    Last edited by Flamingo; 16 February 2020, 21:25.
                    'He died who loved to live,' they'll say,
                    'Unselfishly so we might have today!'
                    Like hell! He fought because he had to fight;
                    He died that's all. It was his unlucky night.
                    http://www.salamanderoasis.org/poems...nnis/luck.html

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                    • Originally posted by DeV View Post
                      The only element of the DF that have gained any personnel is the NSR
                      I see we now have a new direct entry seaman officer in the Naval Service, in the rank of Sub-Lieutenant , aboard the JJ. The key to retention of DE's is to concentrate on sub-specialisation training so that they can "Fit-in" to the myriad requirements of a PDF officer, from looking after your ratings, duties , accounts, guards, ceremonials, discipline, weapon training, naval practices etc., etc. Mentoring alone aboard ship may not work for other appointments or duties.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by ancientmariner View Post
                        I see we now have a new direct entry seaman officer in the Naval Service, in the rank of Sub-Lieutenant , aboard the JJ. The key to retention of DE's is to concentrate on sub-specialisation training so that they can "Fit-in" to the myriad requirements of a PDF officer, from looking after your ratings, duties , accounts, guards, ceremonials, discipline, weapon training, naval practices etc., etc. Mentoring alone aboard ship may not work for other appointments or duties.
                        They are on a 3 year short service commission (after 18 months they can apply for a standard commission without limitation of time) as a S/Lt (same rank as a graduate NS cadet attending NMCI).

                        Read this bit:
                        Short Service Pay, as follows, will be paid to Officers who have not applied for or been offered a commission without limitation as to time within the period time served during their short term Commission. Officers will be entitled to a once-off payment of Short Service Pay, depending on the total consecutive period served as follows:
                        1. €6,349.00 on completion of 1st year of service or
                        2. €6,348.00 on completion of 2nd year of service * or
                        3. €12,697.00 on completion of 3rd year of service *
                        *Short service pay for years 2 and 3 will not be paid if the Officer has applied for and has been offered, a commission without limitation as to time.
                        Short Service Pay, which is non-pensionable, is subject to income tax, PRSI, USC and ASC (see Note 4 in Annex A) in the normal way.
                        Ie DoD is incentiving people to come in for 3 years and leave..... but not encouraging financially them to stay after that is up

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                        • It does get watchkeeping offices back on ships in the short term, and potentially can get ships back at sea again.
                          I don't see the NS offering a similar scheme to the Air Corps to get its recently departed officers back in uniform.
                          Many top rated officers have left in recent years, mostly at LtCdr rank, with at least 2 ships commands under their belt.
                          Or is the shortage in AC different to NS?
                          For now, everything hangs on implementation of the CoDF report.

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                          • The recommissioning is open to all former PDF officers. Maybe the AC is just targeting them?

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                            • Originally posted by hptmurphy View Post
                              I wouldn't have bothered..Its a very sterile book thick with political input and very little input from those on the ground appart for a few officers and one NCO, Like Harveys other book, tough going in places with detail that has been well reported else where.
                              Read it...your assessment was 100% accurate. Bit disappointed to be honest.
                              'History is a vast early warning system'. Norman Cousins

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by DeV View Post
                                They are on a 3 year short service commission (after 18 months they can apply for a standard commission without limitation of time) as a S/Lt (same rank as a graduate NS cadet attending NMCI).

                                Read this bit:

                                Ie DoD is incentiving people to come in for 3 years and leave..... but not encouraging financially them to stay after that is up
                                Certainly looks like that's what they want to happen. Looks like the programme is directed towards filling temporary gaps and not bring in career officers.

                                Possibly assumes that the NS would eventually meet the shortfall with officers who have come up through the training pipeline the 'right way' - through a cadet class.

                                I'd imagine there still is service skepticism of officers who haven't come up through the rigour of a cadet class.

                                @ancientmariner's list details this viewpoint succinctly.

                                Has a DE officer ever commanded an NS ship?

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