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  1. #151
    CQMS The Usual Suspect's Avatar
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    Back to the real world..

    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    ..ad for an "aviation manager" for the Coasties..
    An aviation safety officer for the IRCG; qualified, resolute, and resourced is a strong idea. A public reporting function should be considered. IMHHO.
    Last edited by The Usual Suspect; 25th November 2020 at 22:27.

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  3. #152
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Usual Suspect View Post
    What follows neither draws from; nor has any implications for any events in the real world, past, present, or future.
    It's a purely philosophical/hypothetical argument of theory. IMO has no association with, nor necessarily agrees with, any of the following.


    Have always believed that corporate staff have little incentive to report up and investigate potential, but unrealised, technical issues.

    A diligent staff officer is another creature entirely.

    One thing an Air Force does well is reporting. Concise, unfiltered, unvarnished.

    Major airlines have a Chief Pilot; whose role is, amongst the other functions he/she preforms, similar.

    Best practice appears to be to 'pop' the function out of staff, to reduce further the potential for operational conflicts of interest.

    RAF Safety Centre

    USAF Safety Center
    The problem is the DF is too small

    Having said that there are allegations that CHC was ignoring safety reports from the crews

    I know of at least 1 airline that also uses their safety reporting system to report security observations (which is a good thing btw)

  4. #153
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Usual Suspect View Post
    Back to the real world..



    An aviation safety officer for the IRCG; qualified, resolute, and resourced is a strong idea. A public reporting function should be considered. IMHHO.
    Anything to do with this I wonder - https://assets.gov.ie/20036/207ccb94...43dc54d888.pdf (which is a direct result of the crash)

  5. #154
    CQMS The Usual Suspect's Avatar
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    Think we've finally found something we can agree on Dev.

  6. #155
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoneToTheCanner View Post
    One of the current factors affecting the contract negotiations is pilot pay,which the Govt are very keen to see reduced in the next contract, as well as the dilution of some of the Ts and Cs for pilots. They are very, very expensive, in this contract and it is a factor affecting the choice of the next operator. The crash has also had an effect out of all proportion, on the negotiations. The impending report has implications for the current operator, the future operator, the Coast Guard, the AC and by extension the DoD and several other agencies. The current ad for an "aviation manager" for the Coasties is as a direct result of the crash.
    The crash has brought a lot to light from regulation (lack of), hard/software, safety reports, operational issues.

    For that reason it is only right that it should, at the end of the day 4 people died in the course of the work duties.

    I wouldn't have thought that the contractor would be providing that level of detail - just what service do you want ok it will cost xyz


    Crew experience & qualifications - https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/ab4efe-helicopters/

  7. #156
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    Concise, unfiltered, unvarnished. In fairness to them; they came out with their hands up, and laid the whole thing out..

    .. apart from all the stuff still under judicial process. Which none of us have any opinion on. Bar profound regret at the loss of life.

  8. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    The problem is the DF is too small
    Can you elaborate on this?

  9. #158
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    The role is not a pure "safety officer", as such. It's a new role, with SMS and oversight, as well as contract handling. From what I read of it, it's a rather unique mesh of tasks and responsibilities. It's aimed at a fairly narrow range of people, with quite a broad skillset and qualifications.

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  11. #159
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    Can you elaborate on this?
    The nature of a military is follow orders, make it happen, don’t question and accept risk.

    It is very hard to change that once indoctrinated into it, it is organisational culture. That isn’t specific to the DF or the AC. At times that culture is very positive.

    The DF also moves it personnel around a lot and that could be a pro or con.

    It is also difficult when they aren’t resourced correctly to complete the required tasks.

  12. #160
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    To clarify it, imho, will be hard to recruit and retain people with the right skill set for a safety office as they are moved around so much in the DF

    Safety considerations need to be built into everything

    I’m not saying it isn’t btw

  13. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeV View Post
    To clarify it, imho, will be hard to recruit and retain people with the right skill set for a safety office as they are moved around so much in the DF

    Safety considerations need to be built into everything

    I’m not saying it isn’t btw
    Are you familiar with the Air Corps flight safety structure, culture and reporting mechanisms?

    Military aviation has, particularly in recent years, developed a very different culture and attitude towards safety.

    It is very different and not comparable to the rock apes sending troops up the middle with smoke.

    There is also work being done, albeit at a glacial pace, to develop a DF "Regulator" which is designed to act independently and report directly to the top about safety issues or occurrences across the DF.
    Last edited by Chuck; 26th November 2020 at 10:18.

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  15. #162
    Moderator DeV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    Are you familiar with the Air Corps flight safety structure, culture and reporting mechanisms?

    Military aviation has, particularly in recent years, developed a very different culture and attitude towards safety.

    It is very different and not comparable to the rock apes sending troops up the middle with smoke.

    There is also work being done, albeit at a glacial pace, to develop a DF "Regulator" which is designed to act independently and report directly to the top about safety issues or occurrences across the DF.
    Only from 3 AAIU reports (Dauphin, PC9 and EAS)

    Well that can only be positive

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  17. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    Are you familiar with the Air Corps flight safety structure, culture and reporting mechanisms?

    Military aviation has, particularly in recent years, developed a very different culture and attitude towards safety.

    It is very different and not comparable to the rock apes sending troops up the middle with smoke.

    There is also work being done, albeit at a glacial pace, to develop a DF "Regulator" which is designed to act independently and report directly to the top about safety issues or occurrences across the DF.
    Would that mean they are going to appoint an Inspector General, as legislated for in the Defence Act?

    Has the DF ever had one appointed since the Defence Act was passed?
    It was the year of fire...the year of destruction...the year we took back what was ours.
    It was the year of rebirth...the year of great sadness...the year of pain...and the year of joy.
    It was a new age...It was the end of history.
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  19. #164
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    Picture taken by my Son David at UHG last night AW278 carrying out night vision flying
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  21. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by EUFighter View Post
    And not too be overlooked is that their fleet of 8x NH-90's and 5x AW-109's are providing air lift for an army 2/3 of ours!
    In 2020 we are not quite that small. The NZ Regular Army totals 4710 and 1841 are in the NZ Army Reserve (some 6551 in uniform). Restructuring into 1 Brigade Group, 1 TraDoc Group and expanding the chicken stranglers into a full regiment was the coherent thing to do.

    But I do get your point that the Irish Defence Force has a numbers and resourcing bias too much towards the Army at the expense of the Air and Naval components. If it was located in central Europe like Austria the forces balance would be more appropriate than an island in the north-eastern Atlantic!

    As for helicopters we don't have enough including the Navies 8 SeaSprites for military taskings even though we don't have to worry about Search and Rescue (A NZ Police lead agency role who go to the regional Rescue Helicopters Services or civilian CG Air Patrol nine times out of ten before the NZDF is requested via ministerial channels) and the Police (They have their own independent Eagle Flight). Thus piling more roles like SAR onto an at present undermanned and under resourced Air Corps is probably not a good idea without more resourcing.

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  23. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by CTU View Post
    Would that mean they are going to appoint an Inspector General, as legislated for in the Defence Act?

    Has the DF ever had one appointed since the Defence Act was passed?
    I'm not familiar with the intricacies of the Defence Act but it will involve the establishment of a new cell in DFHQ will will operate independently and report directly to COS.

    It can only be a good thing.

    Not sure if there is anything comparable in other militaries, I'm sure there are.

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  25. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    I'm not familiar with the intricacies of the Defence Act but it will involve the establishment of a new cell in DFHQ will will operate independently and report directly to COS.

    It can only be a good thing.

    Not sure if there is anything comparable in other militaries, I'm sure there are.
    https://revisedacts.lawreform.ie/eli...evised/en/html

    As for international comparisons it sounds similar to what an Inspector General would do.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inspector_general
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offi...ed_States_Army
    It was the year of fire...the year of destruction...the year we took back what was ours.
    It was the year of rebirth...the year of great sadness...the year of pain...and the year of joy.
    It was a new age...It was the end of history.
    It was the year everything changed.

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  27. #168
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    If a DF Inspector general was appointed, with true independence, in the vein and spirit of the AAIU, then it would only be a good thing.

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