Knock has no ramp space. You put three 737s or A320s in it and it's jammed.
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Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner View PostKnock has no ramp space. You put three 737s or A320s in it and it's jammed.It was the year of fire...the year of destruction...the year we took back what was ours.
It was the year of rebirth...the year of great sadness...the year of pain...and the year of joy.
It was a new age...It was the end of history.
It was the year everything changed.
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Hate to be coming across as this guy.
But if we're going to get fast jets, every airfield over 800m should have a QRA capable dispersal facility; And more such airfields should be built.
Carrickfinn would be an ideal prototype location.
Realise this will probably require the establishment of an Air Corps security batt.Last edited by The Usual Suspect; 27 November 2020, 18:23.
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Originally posted by GoneToTheCanner View PostIt's still a small airport. You'd need to add a lot of infrastructure to make it viable; parking, fuel, hangar, etc
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Originally posted by The Usual Suspect View Post
Hate to be coming across as this guy.
But if we're going to get fast jets, every airfield over 800m should have a QRA capable dispersal facility; And more such airfields should be built.
Carrickfinn would be an ideal prototype location.
Realise this will probably require the establishment of an Air Corps security batt.
If the need ever arose there are a good few places they could be dispersed to in an emergency
1 central base and refuel elsewhere as required
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Originally posted by DeV View PostThe AC doesn’t have the personnel or aircraft for detachments, nor is the State big enough.
If the need ever arose there are a good few places they could be dispersed to in an emergency
1 central base and refuel elsewhere as required
Dispersal does not mean a permanent basing, it is a temporary use of an area. It would be good to have a dedicated site like Carrickfinn so that the AC could train for dispersal sites.
It would also give them experience for joint training with the EU Battlegroups, say a detachment in Sweden at a BAS90 strip.
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It certainly makes sense to have options in terms of dispersal/diversions, but I think the idea that you'd need/want several with extensive facilities for a pretty limited (numerically) force that is only a few minutes by flying by time from any no number of usable runways is taking it all to far.
Any of the commercial airfields could support a Gripen det/out-landing, and if you want to practice FOBing you could use West Freugh, or Stornoway, or Luchars, or Keflavik, or any of 50 airfields within comfortable flying range.
Personally I'd use Shannon as the main AC base, and run deployment exercises at Dublin airport for things like EU heads of government summits, and somewhere like West Freugh for really austere exercises.
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Bear in mind that this small country has 9 commercial airports, 1 active military base, 1 inactive military base, dozens of airfields and hundreds of airstrips capable of hosting helicopters, apart from the actual surveyed helipads. More than enough for a small island. That's not counting what's available in the North. You could practise any kind of combat deployment without leaving the Republic, let alone the island.
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Originally posted by Jetjock View PostAnd there still would be no getting away from the fact Knock, like Cork Airport is built at the top of a hill and suffers from a higher proportion of fog bound days than more suitable located airfields.
Delays due to fog are usually down to the increased traffic separation rather than landing requirements which is why fog in London, which has CAT-IIIC airports causes so many delays. There the capacity of the system is at its limit so when ATC increases separation that removes capacity leading to delays and cancellations. Apart from Dublin Airport none of our other airports have capacity limits.
As for the conditions at Knock Airport I would expect most of its low visibility would come from low cloud rather than from fog. They might look similar but are different meteorological conditions with totally different formation criteria.
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Originally posted by ropebag View PostIt certainly makes sense to have options in terms of dispersal/diversions, but I think the idea that you'd need/want several with extensive facilities for a pretty limited (numerically) force that is only a few minutes by flying by time from any no number of usable runways is taking it all to far.
Any of the commercial airfields could support a Gripen det/out-landing, and if you want to practice FOBing you could use West Freugh, or Stornoway, or Luchars, or Keflavik, or any of 50 airfields within comfortable flying range.
Personally I'd use Shannon as the main AC base, and run deployment exercises at Dublin airport for things like EU heads of government summits, and somewhere like West Freugh for really austere exercises.
Dublin Airport is one of the busiest airports in Europe hence why they are getting the second runway. To try and integrate a jet fighter deployment training into DA would be a nightmare and would likely be a non-starter.
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Originally posted by ropebag View PostPersonally I'd use Shannon as the main AC base, and run deployment exercises at Dublin airport for things like EU heads of government summits, and somewhere like West Freugh for really austere exercises.It was the year of fire...the year of destruction...the year we took back what was ours.
It was the year of rebirth...the year of great sadness...the year of pain...and the year of joy.
It was a new age...It was the end of history.
It was the year everything changed.
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(This whole thing is getting into Walt territory) but any QRA jets on the east coast would be a redundant overlap with RAF Lossiemouth- far better to station them on the west coast and enter a service level agreement that the would cover the east and in return we cover the western approaches which benefits them by increasing the depth of their defences.we could use Dublin airport for temporary deployments during summits etc
Shannon would make sense as it’s quiet and the coastguard heli would provide SAR cover for pilot recovery
Another issue not mentioned- most nations have SAR assets with the range to get a ditched pilot back
Also if we were begging for freebies from Joe Hornets would make more sense- twin engines.Last edited by warthog; 28 November 2020, 10:44.
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Originally posted by warthog View Post(This whole thing is getting into Walt territory) but any QRA jets on the east coast would be a redundant overlap with RAF Lossiemouth- far better to station them on the west coast and enter a service level agreement that the would cover the east and in return we cover the western approaches which benefits them by increasing the depth of their defences.we could use Dublin airport for temporary deployments during summits etc
Shannon would make sense as it’s quiet and the coastguard heli would provide SAR cover for pilot recovery
Another issue not mentioned- most nations have SAR assets with the range to get a ditched pilot back
Also if we were begging for freebies from Joe Hornets would make more sense- twin engines.
If you have a engine shut down rate of 1 in 10,000 hrs for that engine type, then a single engine aircraft has a 1:10,000 chance of experiencing a shut down. However if you had a second engine that probability raises to 2:10,000, as both engines have the same probability. In any case the air force with the greatest experience of over water flying the US Navy is currently equipping itself with F-35C's which are single engined. Indeed a lot of the aircraft that it ever operated were single engine aircraft, A-4, A-7, F-8 etc. So while the Hornet could be a good candidate it is not because it is twin engined.
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